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Committee

Local Government and Communities Committee 10 February 2021

10 Feb 2021 · S5 · Local Government and Communities Committee
Item of business
Subordinate Legislation
Homeless Persons (Unsuitable Accommodation) (Scotland) (Modification and Revocation) (Coronavirus) Order 2021 (SSI 2021/10)
Marion Gibbs (Scottish Government) Watch on SPTV
Thank you for the opportunity to speak. Our data collection is comprehensive. I am sure that Sarah Boyack has seen the publications, but we can extract and cross-reference data so, if there are any particular areas that she wants to examine, she can get in contact with us through the minister at any time and we will get some information to her. I back up what the minister said about the increase in temporary accommodation. It is interesting that applications did not increase during the early part of the pandemic, but a lot of people required to be provided with temporary accommodation because no alternative was available to them. For example, they might have stayed with family or friends, but they could not do that because of the way that lockdown happened. That is why we had a natural increase in temporary accommodation during that time, which does not correlate with the number of applications coming in. That is an important thing to consider in relation to people being helped. On the point about failure to accommodate, Glasgow City Council was the main local authority that was unable to or did not provide temporary accommodation, but it has made a huge jump. From October, it has had no failures to provide temporary accommodation, which is really important. With regard to information on the ground, our five housing options hubs throughout Scotland, of which all local authorities are members, had different frequencies of meeting before the pandemic. Because of the pandemic, we suggested that they meet more frequently, and they all took that up, so they are meeting fortnightly. That is an immense source for us to get information out to all local authorities very quickly, and for local authorities to tell us what is happening in their patches. Some local authorities have been doing innovative things such as working with universities to get temporary accommodation in order to cope with the increase. That is really important, as is having different models. An important thing to remember about the housing options hubs is that they are all about sharing experiences and learning from one other. They mean that we have a really good network of people in local authorities, who were all struggling with the main challenges that were coming to them and were having to cope in a completely different landscape. They have been able to share their experiences, learn from one other and respond innovatively at that point, which is really good. The minister mentioned the rapid rehousing transition plans. Local authorities tell us that, if they had not had the transition plans, which were put to us in December 2018 and therefore had a full year of implementation, they would not be where they are now in relation to recovery. The figures for people in temporary accommodation might look high, but it is not because local authorities are not meeting their duties; the figures show the opposite of that. Local authorities are meeting their duties and ensuring that people are supported, safe and secure during this period. I think that I have covered most of the points.

In the same item of business

The Convener SNP
Under agenda item 4, the committee will take evidence from the minister on the order. Andy Wightman has lodged a motion to annul this negative instrument, wh...
Kevin Stewart SNP
I thank the committee for the opportunity to outline the work that led to the laying of the order. It is clear from the First Minister’s daily updates that t...
The Convener SNP
We know that COSLA backs the extension, but what about front-line organisations that work with homeless people? Do they say that people are happy to remain i...
Kevin Stewart SNP
As the committee is well aware, I have regular meetings with front-line organisations, because I want to know exactly what is going on out there. I met a num...
Sarah Boyack Lab
I draw members’ attention to my entry in the register of interests about my former employment with the Scottish Federation of Housing Associations. Minister...
Kevin Stewart SNP
There were a huge number of questions there, but I would expect nothing less from Ms Boyack. I will bring in Marion Gibbs to describe some of the detail of w...
Marion Gibbs (Scottish Government)
Thank you for the opportunity to speak. Our data collection is comprehensive. I am sure that Sarah Boyack has seen the publications, but we can extract and c...
The Convener SNP
I think that you have. Minister, do you want to come back in?
Kevin Stewart SNP
I think that we have covered almost all the bases. If we missed anything, we are happy to come back to the committee on it.
The Convener SNP
Sarah, are you happy with that?
Sarah Boyack Lab
Yes. I also asked about the proposed national temporary accommodation task force, but I will come back to that later if the minister has not said anything ab...
Andy Wightman (Lothian) (Ind) Ind
Good morning, minister. It has been eight or nine months since the original order came into force in May 2020, and we are being invited to extend that again ...
Kevin Stewart SNP
I remind the committee that we brought in the change, early, in May; we were not going to do that until the tail end of this parliamentary session. However, ...
Andy Wightman Ind
I challenge the notion that the people on the front line to whom you have spoken regard that as being of some utility. Shelter Scotland has told us that the ...
Kevin Stewart SNP
My officials talk to Shelter Scotland all the time. We have asked for examples of all such issues because I would follow them up. However, I do not have any ...
Andy Wightman Ind
Finally, I have a quick question about the rights of families and pregnant women to suitable temporary accommodation. Are they being fully met?
Kevin Stewart SNP
I expect local authorities to ensure that pregnant women and families with children are suitably accommodated. That is essential. From what I am seeing, we a...
Marion Gibbs
The unsuitable accommodation order still applies to pregnant women and families with children. We still have the normal rule that has been in place since 201...
The Convener SNP
We now consider motion S5M-23878, in the name of Andy Wightman, which asks the committee to recommend that the Homeless Persons (Unsuitable Accommodation) (S...
Andy Wightman Ind
There have been two extensions to the temporary exemption from the order—first until 30 September 2020 and then until 31 January 2021. The instrument would e...
Sarah Boyack Lab
I agree with Andy Wightman’s comments. People are going through horrendous experiences. We are in a difficult position, but I cannot support Andy’s proposal,...
Keith Brown SNP
I do not agree with Andy Wightman’s position. He does not seem to accept that local authorities have responsibilities in relation to how they manage their pa...
Kevin Stewart SNP
I agree with a great deal of what has been said by Ms Boyack and Mr Brown. Without doubt, as Ms Boyack said, vulnerability has been exacerbated by Covid. We ...
The Convener SNP
I invite Andy Wightman to respond to the debate.
Andy Wightman Ind
Time is pressing, so I will be brief. I accept that local authorities have their view and that the minister has his view. Whether homeless people should have...
The Convener SNP
The question is, that motion S5M-23878, in the name of Andy Wightman, be agreed to. Are we agreed? I can see that we are not agreed, so there will be a div...
The Convener SNP
The result of the division is: For 1, Against 6, Abstentions 0. Motion disagreed to.
The Convener SNP
The committee has agreed not to recommend to Parliament that the instrument be annulled, and has made no recommendation to Parliament in respect of the instr...