Committee
Justice Sub-Committee on Policing 18 January 2021
18 Jan 2021 · S5 · Justice Sub-Committee on Policing
Item of business
Remotely Piloted Aircraft Systems and Body-worn Video Cameras
Assistant Chief Constable Williams
Watch on SPTV
I will say a couple of things; I will mention body-worn video here as well, because practical examples can be given of how to evaluate and measure the effectiveness of that technology, but I am sure that Chief Superintendent Richards will have more to add. I was involved at the start of the consideration of body-worn video a number of years ago—Inaudible.—progress at any great pace. A lot of work was done to evaluate its use in the north-east and some practical and appropriate measures were used, such as the number of assaults on officers; the level of police complaints, how they were closed off and whether the body-worn video helped with the timeline for those; and the number of early guilty pleas in the criminal justice system as a result of footage recorded by body-worn video. Those were some very practical measures whose benefits were easy to articulate and very powerful. Drones are less straightforward in many ways; there are quite easy measures around efficiency because drones are part of our air support unit and they are a build-on and an asset that can be used instead of the police helicopter. The raw economics are that drones are clearly better value for the public purse, because they are far cheaper on an hour-by-hour basis, but they cannot do as much as a helicopter in many other ways. For example, they have a shorter flight time and cannot carry passengers—those are the obvious examples. However, we are considering other ways to measure the effectiveness of drones, which include going through every incident that they have been deployed to and looking at the success and utility of that deployment—for example, for the purposes of photographing a serious crime scene or a road junction where there has been a fatal accident—and whether that has enabled the inquiry officers and the senior investigating officers to proceed through their reporting channels more effectively and with greater ease. Some less tangible work will take place with drones; that work is on-going, and part of the evaluation back to the Scottish Police Authority will capture that.
In the same item of business
The Convener
Green
Our main item of business is an evidence session on Police Scotland’s use of remotely piloted aircraft systems, which are more commonly known as drones, and ...
Assistant Chief Constable Mark Williams (Police Scotland)
I am happy to do so. You mentioned the two specific assessments that took place on receipt of the drones; they have been reviewed and updated annually since ...
The Convener
Green
Can you comment on that, Mr Sillers?
Barry Sillers (Scottish Police Authority)
Certainly. I confirm that when the SPA’s strategy, policy and performance committee considered use of RPAS at its meeting in May 2019, we were given sight of...
The Convener
Green
I note that Mark Williams said that assessments “were in place prior to operational deployment”, but were all the assessments of drones and BWV undertaken be...
Assistant Chief Constable Williams
The assessments were, for a number of important reasons, carried out concurrently and on receipt of the final product. First, we did not feel that the detail...
The Convener
Green
Surely you assess the capability of product A, B or C for its intended use before you acquire it—at considerable expense to the public purse—rather than afte...
Assistant Chief Constable Williams
I reassure you again that an EQHRIA and a DPIA are in place, and were in place prior to operational use of the technologies. The technology and supply of dr...
The Convener
Green
I am not sure that I am reassured. My colleagues have a number of questions.
Shona Robison (Dundee City East) (SNP)
SNP
Good morning. What level of stakeholder engagement was there in drawing up the assessments? Were any significant concerns raised prior to acquisition of dron...
Assistant Chief Constable Williams
We carried out a significant period of research in the three or four years prior to procurement of drones. That was in order to understand and benchmark dron...
Shona Robison
SNP
Were any significant concerns raised by any of the stakeholders whom you consulted?
Assistant Chief Constable Williams
A number of concerns were raised in relation to, for example, article 8 of the European convention on human rights, on the right to privacy. We were careful ...
Shona Robison
SNP
Thank you for that. Looking ahead, what further assessments will need to be made as such technologies develop and their use increases? Do you envisage early ...
Assistant Chief Constable Williams
Absolutely. The force absolutely recognises that new and emerging technologies, of which drones are one, represent a developmental area that requires clear g...
Shona Robison
SNP
I invite Matthew Richards to respond.
Chief Superintendent Matthew Richards (Police Scotland)
The ACC has articulated the stakeholder assessment with regard to RPAS. From my perspective, it is important to note that the force does not have a national ...
Shona Robison
SNP
Thank you; that was most helpful.
Barry Sillers
On the more general point about the eminently good practice of local engagement, I refer to the SPA’s written submission. At the start of her questions Shona...
Shona Robison
SNP
You anticipated my final question, which was going to be on the SPA’s recommendation for an evaluation of the use of body-worn cameras. You have said that ex...
Barry Sillers
Certainly. The quality of the evaluation increases the more different people you engage with—for instance, the Scottish Institute for Policing Research submi...
Rona Mackay (Strathkelvin and Bearsden) (SNP)
SNP
I would like to ask generally about the new technologies that are being bought and will be implemented. There are many claims made about the benefits of thos...
Assistant Chief Constable Williams
I will say a couple of things; I will mention body-worn video here as well, because practical examples can be given of how to evaluate and measure the effect...
Rona Mackay
SNP
Thank you. As no one else wants to come in with an opinion on that, my questions are finished, convener.
The Convener
Green
Thank you. Our next series of questions is from Fulton MacGregor.
Fulton MacGregor (Coatbridge and Chryston) (SNP)
SNP
Good morning. Witnesses will be aware that the sub-committee was recently—Inaudible.—that Police Scotland had a sound legal basis for the use of cyber kiosks...
Assistant Chief Constable Williams
I think that I picked up all that, although the sound broke slightly. I am happy to cover the codes of practice and the legislation that underpins drones. Th...
Fulton MacGregor
SNP
Thank you for that comprehensive answer. Do the other witnesses want to add anything to that?
Chief Superintendent Richards
I will come in now with regard to body-worn video, if that is in order. Along the lines of the points that the ACC raised, articles 2, 6 and 8 of the ECHR wi...
Barry Sillers
Part of the revised evaluation of remotely piloted aircraft systems that the authorities asked for in March included the Civil Aviation Authority audit that ...