Chamber
Meeting of the Parliament (Hybrid) 26 November 2020
26 Nov 2020 · S5 · Meeting of the Parliament
Item of business
Independent Review of Grouse Moor Management
Gail Ross raises an important point. As she mentions, in the opening of the report, Professor Werritty identifies the passion and strength of feeling on both sides, which he had not fully appreciated. I am acutely aware of that as, in my role, I often have to deal with some of those complex issues. All too often, the issues are portrayed in a very black and white way when, in reality, they are never that straightforward. There is a lack of trust and understanding on both sides, and that feeds into and leads to completely polarised opinions. I genuinely hope that the measures that I have outlined will bring greater transparency, which in turn can help to build trust. The member raises a vital point that I hope we can develop and build on.
In the same item of business
The Deputy Presiding Officer (Linda Fabiani)
SNP
The next item of business is a statement by Mairi Gougeon on the independent review of grouse moor management. The minister will take questions at the end of...
The Minister for Rural Affairs and the Natural Environment (Mairi Gougeon)
SNP
In 2017, the Cabinet Secretary for Environment, Climate Change and Land Reform commissioned an independent group to look at the environmental impact of grous...
The Deputy Presiding Officer
SNP
The minister will now take questions on the issues raised in her statement. I can allow about 20 minutes for those. However, we have a lot of questions, so I...
Liz Smith (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Con)
Con
I thank the minister for prior sight of her statement. I welcome the fact that, after a lengthy and costly delay, the Scottish Government has finally respond...
Mairi Gougeon
SNP
I thank Liz Smith for those important questions. I will try to respond to them all. On her first point, about the Werritty group’s recommendation on waiting...
Claudia Beamish (South Scotland) (Lab)
Lab
I thank the minister for prior sight of her statement. Scottish Labour has long called for a licensing system and the minister’s statement today is welcome f...
Mairi Gougeon
SNP
The changes that we would need to make in order to introduce licensing would require changes to primary legislation. As members will be aware, we simply do n...
The Deputy Presiding Officer
SNP
The opening questions have taken too much time. I ask everyone to bear brevity in mind.
Gillian Martin (Aberdeenshire East) (SNP)
SNP
I thank the minister for working with the Environment, Climate Change and Land Reform Committee on this issue and for the very welcome measures and the swift...
Mairi Gougeon
SNP
I thank Gillian Martin for that question, because I hope that the recommendations that we have announced today in response to the Werritty report will have a...
Jamie Halcro Johnston (Highlands and Islands) (Con)
Con
The independent review pointed to the lack of an agreed definition of a grouse shooting business as a key barrier to proposals around licensing. Although I a...
Mairi Gougeon
SNP
Our current licensing proposals would apply to driven grouse shooting. However, again, we need to tease out a lot of these issues and we need to look at them...
Angus MacDonald (Falkirk East) (SNP)
SNP
I welcome all the actions that are detailed in the minister’s statement. However, by way of clarification, will the minister outline who will oversee the lic...
Mairi Gougeon
SNP
As I said in previous answers, we will set out our proposals for a future licensing scheme in due course. However, it is likely that NatureScot would be resp...
Alex Rowley (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Lab)
Lab
I, too, welcome the Scottish Government’s announcement. I particularly welcome the introduction of a licence scheme for grouse shooting, which is a step in t...
Mairi Gougeon
SNP
That is why we have already taken measures. Wildlife crime, by its nature and because of where it takes place, presents issues with evidence gathering, which...
Gail Ross (Caithness, Sutherland and Ross) (SNP)
SNP
Professor Werritty writes in his report that, when he accepted the invitation to lead the review, he did not fully appreciate “the complexity of the issues ...
Mairi Gougeon
SNP
Gail Ross raises an important point. As she mentions, in the opening of the report, Professor Werritty identifies the passion and strength of feeling on both...
Mark Ruskell (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Green)
Green
The Greens welcome the proposals on muirburn, but licensing schemes are only as effective as the aims of those who design them, and it appears that the propo...
Mairi Gougeon
SNP
As I said in my response to Jamie Halcro Johnston, there will be a consultation before any licensing scheme is introduced. It is in our best interests to eng...
Liam McArthur (Orkney Islands) (LD)
LD
Scottish Liberal Democrats have been calling for licensing of driven grouse moors, so I very much welcome the minister’s statement. There needs to be a bette...
Mairi Gougeon
SNP
I will be happy to keep Liam McArthur—and any other member who seeks that information—updated on the matter. It is not possible for me to set out in stone to...
Finlay Carson (Galloway and West Dumfries) (Con)
Con
I repeat that the Scottish Conservatives absolutely condemn in the strongest terms the abhorrent persecution of raptors. The minister has stated that some o...
Mairi Gougeon
SNP
I am sorry, but I must disagree with the way in which Finlay Carson has portrayed some of the work. I do not understand his point about the Werritty group ge...
The Deputy Presiding Officer
SNP
I ask Mr Gibson to be very quick.
Kenneth Gibson (Cunninghame North) (SNP)
SNP
I welcome the minister’s long-awaited statement. She will be aware of the killing and disappearance of birds of prey during the lockdown. Will she expand on ...
Mairi Gougeon
SNP
Like everyone in the chamber and across Scotland, I am sure, I have been angered by the reports of killings and the disappearances of birds of prey that appe...
The Deputy Presiding Officer
SNP
I will allow a final question, which will be from Alison Johnstone.
Alison Johnstone (Lothian) (Green)
Green
Thank you, Presiding Officer. On average, 26,000 mountain hares are killed in Scotland annually in the mistaken belief that it boosts grouse numbers. I am co...
Mairi Gougeon
SNP
I am sorry, but I have to completely disagree with what Alison Johnstone has said. This is not about giving shooting interests one last chance. Right now, th...