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Chamber

Meeting of the Parliament (Hybrid) 25 November 2020

25 Nov 2020 · S5 · Meeting of the Parliament
Item of business
Legal Advice (Publication)

We should not be having this debate. I say to Government members who will likely criticise the use of parliamentary time for a topic such as this in the middle of a pandemic: I agree, but this is on the Government.

The Parliament has expressed a clear will that it wishes to see the legal advice regarding the conduct of the judicial review that was raised by the former First Minister. It did so three weeks ago, yet we are still waiting. The SNP Government is dangerously close to standing in contempt of the chamber.

Why does the legal advice matter? Because in its pages we will finally see the anatomy of a collective thought process that led to the collapse of a Government case at a cost to the taxpayer in the order of £1 million but, more importantly, because it will show why the women at the heart of this were denied a fair hearing and access to justice for complaints that will now most likely never see the light of day again.

The Committee on the Scottish Government Handling of Harassment Complaints has heard from those in the Government who were most connected to the judicial review, including those who head up the Government’s legal services division, the permanent secretary, who was the first of two named responders in the petition, and the Lord Advocate. However, although the Government’s legal position is a matter of public record, the legal advice is still shrouded in abject mystery.

The Government first sought the advice of independent senior counsel in September 2017, shortly after the original petition was launched. Before a judicial review is fully commenced, permission for it to be heard must be granted by the court. The criteria for granting permission to proceed hinged on the court’s belief that the petition in the name of Alex Salmond had a realistic prospect of success. Permission was duly granted by the court and the Government did not contest that ruling. From that, we can infer that, right out of the traps, the Government understood that there was a real prospect of defeat, with all that that entailed for the public purse and the complainers—but still, it decided to proceed.

Legal advice is never offered in absolutes. A Queen’s counsel will never tell a party that they will win a case. Instead, they will offer an assessment of the balance of probabilities, with the chance of success weighed against the risk of defeat. In the foothills of this judicial review, the Government believed that it was facing a challenge to the procedure. However, as the weeks dragged on, it became clear from the incremental retrieval of evidence by the Government—sometimes forcibly brought out by the court itself—that the Government was far more exposed on the application of that procedure by the civil service on the grounds of apparent bias.

That drip-drip release of emails and correspondence towards the ends of 2017, which would ultimately lead to the collapse of the case, was a shocking way for the Government to have behaved towards the court. Fundamentally, it changed the kind of difficulty that the Government was facing and, very probably, it gave cause for the Government’s senior counsel to threaten to resign.

Without the production of legal advice, the Salmond inquiry cannot hope to discharge its responsibilities in full. It will leave yet another tang of doubt around the actions of the First Minister, who we now know had ultimate sign-off over the tactics of how the judicial review was handled. The optics of that are terrible for the SNP and everything about it reeks of a cover-up.

It has been three weeks since the Parliament demanded the release of the advice and the Government remains defiant to the supremacy of the chamber. Our patience is at an end. Should the Deputy First Minister not deliver what we seek in short order, he may well face another kind of motion in the coming days—one that tests the confidence of members and those responsible for blocking the will of the Parliament.

In the same item of business

The Presiding Officer (Ken Macintosh) NPA
The next item of business is a debate on motion S5M-23445, in the name of Murdo Fraser, on legal advice. I encourage all members who wish to contribute to pr...
Murdo Fraser (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Con) Con
Three weeks ago, Parliament resolved that the Scottish Government should hand over to the Committee on the Scottish Government Handling of Harassment Complai...
The Deputy First Minister and Cabinet Secretary for Education and Skills (John Swinney) SNP
Earlier this month, when Parliament last debated this issue, I set out the reasons why Scottish ministers considered that the balance of public interest lay ...
Murdo Fraser Con
The Deputy First Minister is aware that the committee has been asking for sight of that legal advice, not in the past three weeks but for many months before ...
John Swinney SNP
I will make two points. The first is that, although the committee has been asking for the legal advice, the Government has been maintaining its position, whi...
Alex Cole-Hamilton (Edinburgh Western) (LD) LD
The Deputy First Minister’s recollection of the Lord Advocate’s evidence to our committee is correct. One of the things that the Lord Advocate would not disc...
John Swinney SNP
I think that Mr Cole-Hamilton knows the answer to that, but I presume that he raises it so that I can confirm it. The ministerial code prevents me from disc...
Jackie Baillie (Dumbarton) (Lab) Lab
It is tempting to make the same speech that I made the last time we debated this issue, because in the past three weeks, absolutely nothing has changed—not o...
John Swinney SNP
Would Jackie Baillie care to share with Parliament any of the detail of the correspondence that I shared with the committee about the obligations that I am u...
Jackie Baillie Lab
I would be happy to share that. It is available on the website. However, I say to the cabinet secretary that he has had not just the time that the committee ...
Andy Wightman (Lothian) (Green) Green
Here we go again. As members have already stated, the Parliament expressed its will in unequivocal terms and voted on 4 November. I want to reflect on the qu...
Alex Cole-Hamilton (Edinburgh Western) (LD) LD
We should not be having this debate. I say to Government members who will likely criticise the use of parliamentary time for a topic such as this in the midd...
The Presiding Officer NPA
I am conscious that this is a debate, so I have given as much time as possible for interventions. However, we are pushed for time, so members have only four ...
Margaret Mitchell (Central Scotland) (Con) Con
Three weeks have elapsed since the Scottish Parliament agreed to a motion calling on the Scottish Government to publish all the legal advice that it received...
Stewart Stevenson (Banffshire and Buchan Coast) (SNP) SNP
I start by agreeing with Murdo Fraser when he sympathised with the complainers, which was entirely proper. Let us look at precedents in relation to the disc...
James Kelly (Glasgow) (Lab) Lab
Here we go again. For the second time in three weeks, we are having a debate that concentrates on the release of legal advice pertaining to the judicial revi...
James Dornan (Glasgow Cathcart) (SNP) SNP
Yesterday, we saw the Parliament at its finest, working across parties to pass an important piece of legislation for people across the whole of Scotland. It ...
Murdo Fraser Con
On a point of order, Presiding Officer, I am sure that you are aware that standing orders require members to address the terms of the topic of the debate. We...
The Presiding Officer NPA
I have been following the member’s contribution with close interest, Mr Fraser. He has been making a point. However, he has now made his point with his compa...
James Dornan SNP
Thank you, Presiding Officer—although I have to say that pointing out the hypocrisy of the Tories is very important to what the debate is all about. As my c...
Annie Wells (Glasgow) (Con) Con
As members have said, here we are again. I had thought that the SNP would, after it lost the crucial vote in the chamber three weeks ago on a motion that had...
Shona Robison (Dundee City East) (SNP) SNP
I begin by reiterating what I said in the debate on 4 November. I made three points then on the issue of legal advice, and I wish to repeat them. First, as ...
Jackie Baillie Lab
Now we know. We know from today’s speeches, from the briefings to the SNP group and from the reports to their meetings by John Swinney that the Scottish Gove...
John Swinney SNP
I will reflect on a couple of the contributions, because they illustrate the arguments that I gave in my opening speech. Stewart Stevenson brought his deep ...
John Swinney SNP
I will develop the point and happily give way to Jackie Baillie. I made the point earlier that ministers today have a duty to ministers in the future, which...
Jackie Baillie Lab
The fundamental difference that John Swinney fails to mention is that we never faced, and lost, a vote in the Parliament and were never in a situation in whi...
John Swinney SNP
That is not the fundamental point; the fundamental point is the maintenance of legal professional privilege, which has existed in law for all time, and which...
Andy Wightman Green
Can we take it from the cabinet secretary’s observations that he has no intention of publishing any legal advice in relation to the judicial review?
John Swinney SNP
I am simply airing to the Parliament the issues with which I have to wrestle. I am the minister who will have to decide on the question, and I am simply airi...
Donald Cameron (Highlands and Islands) (Con) Con
I refer members to my entry in the register of members’ interests as a member of the Faculty of Advocates. I will begin on a bit of a tangent, and I hope th...