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Chamber

Meeting of the Parliament (Hybrid) 18 November 2020

18 Nov 2020 · S5 · Meeting of the Parliament
Item of business
Safe Schools
Mackay, Rona SNP Strathkelvin and Bearsden Watch on SPTV

As a member of the Education and Skills Committee, I am pleased to be able to speak in the debate, which is on such an important topic.

There are points in the Green motion with which I agree whole-heartedly. Schools are the best place for teaching, and they must be safe for pupils and teachers during this horrible pandemic. That is an absolute priority of this Government. Absence rates of pupils and teachers should always be taken seriously. Disadvantaged areas are being harder hit, which is, sadly, an all-too-familiar fact during this pandemic.

It is absolutely unacceptable for any teacher to feel pressured to return to school when they have been notified by the Protect Scotland app of a potential exposure risk, and it is absolutely unacceptable for clinically vulnerable teachers to be pressured into returning against the specific advice of their general practitioners. However, I do not accept the premise that the Government has not prepared adequately for the impact of Covid-19 on schools, or that those issues have not been addressed.

More than 1,250 new teachers and support staff have been recruited as a result of the £80 million of ring-fenced support that was announced in June. Plans are under way to recruit another 200 teachers. An additional 155 support staff have also been hired, with a further 100 expected to follow.

The Scottish Government’s updated guidance on reducing the risks in schools has detailed information on all aspects of learning and working in schools during Covid-19. Crucially, arrangements are in place for staff who are concerned that they might have been at risk of infection to have informed access to testing through their employer, the local authority.

Of course, staffing arrangements are a matter for local authorities as employers, as others have said, and they have been doing an excellent job of coping with the challenges that Covid-19 has brought this year. The guidance makes it clear that councils and schools should ensure that risk assessments are in place, including for those who are at the highest risk.

The decisions on where teachers and school staff who have previously been shielding are deployed are for individual schools and local authorities. As the guidance outlines, risk assessments should consider measures that can be taken to lower the risk of transmission among staff and pupils in all parts of the school. Among a raft of safety advice, the guidance makes it clear that altering class size and composition is one option that schools can consider to help to maintain distancing.

My local authority area, East Dunbartonshire, is, like many others in the west of Scotland, currently at level 4. It is understandable that anxiety rates are high. As the First Minister outlined in her briefing today, the chief medical officer will issue a letter, similar to a fit note, that can be used in the few cases in which, following updating of risk assessments and discussions with employers, it is not possible to make a workplace safe for staff. That will last for as long as the local area is under level 4 restrictions. Staff should use the period that is covered by the letter to discuss further any concerns with their employer—the local authority, in this instance—or an occupational health adviser. If, following individualised risk assessments, action results in adequate protection in the workplace, they will be able to continue to attend work.

The Green motion is well intentioned, but I ask that the Greens take on board the measures that the Scottish Government has put in place to keep pupils and staff safe. Our children and our amazing hard-working teachers should have all the support that they need during this extraordinary time.

15:39  

In the same item of business

The Deputy Presiding Officer (Lewis Macdonald) Lab
The next item of business is a debate on motion S5M-23385, in the name of Ross Greer, on safe schools. 14:51
Ross Greer (West Scotland) (Green) Green
I know that I speak on behalf of us all when I say thank you to every teacher, member of school staff, pupil, parent and carer for their efforts over the pas...
The Deputy First Minister and Cabinet Secretary for Education and Skills (John Swinney) SNP
I welcome the debate. I whole-heartedly agree with the point in the motion that “education is best delivered in the classroom”. I also agree that keeping o...
Ross Greer Green
On the cabinet secretary’s point about data suggesting that there is no significant transmission between pupils in schools, will he respond to the issues tha...
John Swinney SNP
The point that I was making was about the evidence that has emerged from the PCR—polymerase chain reaction—testing that is undertaken on children. It is indi...
Jamie Greene (West Scotland) (Con) Con
I thank Ross Greer for using his party’s time for this debate. We disagree on many things, but on education we share a passion to get it right for every chil...
Iain Gray (East Lothian) (Lab) Lab
I support the motion and I associate myself with the remarks of Ross Greer and the Deputy First Minister, in particular, about the efforts of local authoriti...
John Swinney SNP
I want to make explicit that the papers were prepared to inform the debate and not because the debate was happening; the statistics were pre-scheduled to be ...
Iain Gray Lab
I take that point and accept it absolutely. However, concerns about whether schools should remain open are not new and it would have been helpful if the stat...
Beatrice Wishart (Shetland Islands) (LD) LD
I, too, echo what others have said about the hard work of teachers, pupils and local authorities in the recent challenging months. I am pleased that safe sch...
The Deputy Presiding Officer Lab
We now move to the open debate. 15:19
Patrick Harvie (Glasgow) (Green) Green
Like many members, I represent constituents who will be moved into level 4 restrictions from Friday. The prevalence of Covid in Glasgow remains, as the First...
The Deputy Presiding Officer Lab
I apologise for the fact that we were not able to see Patrick Harvie, although we certainly heard him. 15:22
Clare Adamson (Motherwell and Wishaw) (SNP) SNP
I thank Ross Greer for securing the debate and I echo his and other members’ praise for the efforts of our teachers and our school communities at this time. ...
Daniel Johnson (Edinburgh Southern) (Lab) Lab
Will the member give way?
Jamie Halcro Johnston (Highlands and Islands) (Con) Con
Will Clare Adamson take an intervention?
Clare Adamson SNP
I will take an intervention from Mr Halcro Johnston.
Jamie Halcro Johnston Con
Is Clare Adamson absolutely sure that there are not children and young people who have been missing out at school because they do not have the technology or ...
Clare Adamson SNP
I think that the issue is about local implementation. I have examples from one local authority area, where one school is ensuring that home support, digital ...
Liz Smith (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Con) Con
When future generations come to study the Covid era, I am certain that two things will stand out: first, the extraordinarily difficult decisions that all Gov...
Monica Lennon (Central Scotland) (Lab) Lab
I am grateful to Ross Greer and the Scottish Greens for lodging the motion, which we support. I put on the record my deep gratitude to pupils, staff and pare...
Rona Mackay (Strathkelvin and Bearsden) (SNP) SNP
As a member of the Education and Skills Committee, I am pleased to be able to speak in the debate, which is on such an important topic. There are points in ...
Daniel Johnson (Edinburgh Southern) (Lab) Lab
As we face the crisis that is caused by the Covid pandemic, it is incumbent on us to continue to question and challenge, and to continue to ask ourselves whe...
Jamie Halcro Johnston (Highlands and Islands) (Con) Con
I welcome the recognition around the chamber that the pandemic has been difficult for pupils and teachers across our schools. It is right that we are able to...
John Swinney SNP
I agree with a lot of what has been discussed in the debate. I think that Mr Greer characterised it fairly when he said that there is not an awful lot of dif...
Daniel Johnson Lab
Will the cabinet secretary acknowledge that the ability to implement such measures comes down to schools having enough resources so that teachers are freed u...
John Swinney SNP
I do not think that that is a fair point: if a member of staff is judged clinically not fit to be at school, they should not be at school, and there should b...
Johann Lamont Lab
Will the cabinet secretary give way?
John Swinney SNP
Of course.
Johann Lamont Lab
I will take the cabinet secretary away from Twitter for once. My concern is about disadvantaged young people who are not engaging with education at all. Wha...