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Chamber

Meeting of the Parliament (Hybrid) 22 September 2020

22 Sep 2020 · S5 · Meeting of the Parliament
Item of business
Residential Outdoor Centres

As the member is aware, outdoor centres operate under a number of different models. Some are run by local authorities, some are third sector, some are private and so forth. We do not have the influence that the member perhaps thinks we have on which institutions close. However, I have not seen the children’s commissioner’s communication, and I will certainly look at it and take it on board.

The Scottish Government absolutely recognises the very difficult position in which many of our outdoor centres find themselves. The Scottish Advisory Panel for Outdoor Education has asked whether a review date can be identified for a further examination of the Covid-19 guidance in relation to overnight residential stays; other members have referred to that. I am sure that members will recognise the difficulties for the Government in setting a review date at a point in time when Covid-19 cases are on the rise in Scotland, and as we are beginning to come to terms with the First Minister’s profound announcement this afternoon. However, we will continue to monitor the situation closely.

An area of policy where we can take further action is the apparent inconsistency in application of the current guidelines. Very good practice in some areas could, and should, be shared more widely among local authorities, as members mentioned. Some authorities and schools might not be taking full advantage of the opportunities for day visits. Some are ruling out all residential overnight stays for the entire school year. In recognition of the compelling case that has been made by the sector, I make a commitment that Scottish ministers will engage further with the advisory group and local authority partners as soon as possible to address the issues that were raised today and during debate on the issue in the past few weeks. We can also do more to highlight, clearly and prominently, what can be done under current regulations and we can see what can be done to develop a more consistent and positive application of the current guidance across Scotland’s local authorities.

We are listening closely to the points that have been made in this debate. We are listening very closely to outdoor education centres in Scotland. I pay tribute to all their efforts and to their resilience in the current difficult times, to the support that they are giving to our young people, and to their professional commitment and dedication to outdoor education. It is an important part of Scotland’s education landscape, as has been highlighted by many members.

We will look in detail at the different funding mechanisms that are available at national and local level, and we will explore how those funding streams can be deployed more effectively.

Today’s debate has been an important opportunity to highlight the role that our outdoor education centres play in Scotland. We must recognise the urgent challenges that they face and explore what more can be done. The Scottish Government remains a powerful supporter of the role that outdoor education centres play. I finish by paying tribute to the sector and thanking all members for their contributions. I assure members that we are listening very closely to representations.

Meeting closed at 18:22.  

In the same item of business

The Deputy Presiding Officer (Linda Fabiani) SNP
The final item of business today is a members’ business debate on motion S5M-22652, in the name of Liz Smith, on residential outdoor centres. The debate will...
Liz Smith (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Con) Con
I thank all the members who signed the motion and all those who will contribute to this evening’s debate. I open the debate with two personal experiences in...
The Deputy Presiding Officer SNP
We move to the open debate. We have lots of speakers so I ask members to stick to speeches of no more than four minutes. Bruce Crawford will be followed by J...
Bruce Crawford (Stirling) (SNP) SNP
I am not now—for once I am not silent.
The Deputy Presiding Officer SNP
I am pleased to hear it. Would you like to start again?
Bruce Crawford SNP
Thank you. I welcome the debate, and thank Liz Smith for bringing it to the chamber. The outdoor facilities under discussion have formed a small but importan...
Jamie Greene (West Scotland) (Con) Con
I thank Liz Smith for bringing the debate to the chamber. When she said that she had secured a members’ business debate, I was proactively pleased about part...
Daniel Johnson (Edinburgh Southern) (Lab) Lab
I echo the thanks to Liz Smith for securing the debate. The issue is a crucial one that will affect our ability to educate our young people in a fundamental ...
Maurice Corry (West Scotland) (Con) Con
I, too, thank my colleague Liz Smith for leading the debate and for bringing it to the chamber. I join her in recognising the urgent challenges facing the se...
The Deputy Presiding Officer SNP
Thank you, Mr Corry. I am glad that it was only four weeks that you were there for; otherwise we might have been here a lot longer. 17:33
Mark Ruskell (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Green) Green
I warmly welcome the debate and thank Liz Smith for securing it. Perhaps it represents a timely bridge between her previous portfolio responsibility for educ...
Liam McArthur (Orkney Islands) (LD) LD
I thank Liz Smith for allowing the debate to take place. From our time together on the Education and Skills Committee, I know that she has been a long-time a...
The Deputy Presiding Officer SNP
Quite a few more members would like to speak in the debate, so I am happy to accept a motion, under rule 8.14.3, that the debate be extended by up to 30 minu...
The Deputy Presiding Officer SNP
I call Jeremy Balfour. 17:41
Jeremy Balfour (Lothian) (Con) Con
Thank you, Presiding Officer. I will not take up the full 30 minutes that you have just given us as an extension. Laughter. As other members have done, I de...
Edward Mountain (Highlands and Islands) (Con) Con
The expertise is not just in taking people rock climbing, canoeing and things such as Jeremy Balfour mentioned; it is also about dealing with children. That ...
Jeremy Balfour Con
Mr Mountain has made a fair and good point. That expertise could disappear; staff might decide to go off and find jobs in other areas, so when centres reopen...
Claudia Beamish (South Scotland) (Lab) Lab
I thank Liz Smith MSP for bringing the debate to Parliament and for her inspiring call to save our outdoor centres. Scotland’s residential outdoor centres h...
Fulton MacGregor (Coatbridge and Chryston) (SNP) SNP
I thank Liz Smith for lodging the motion for debate. I disagree with very little of what she said, and I welcome the consensual and non-party-political manne...
The Deputy Presiding Officer SNP
You are all going a bit over the four minutes. I am worried that we are going to run out of time again. 17:56
Brian Whittle (South Scotland) (Con) Con
I add my congratulations to my colleague Liz Smith on securing time in the chamber for us to debate an incredibly important issue. Glaisnock House, 1981, wi...
Colin Smyth (South Scotland) (Lab) Lab
I echo the thanks to Liz Smith for bringing this incredibly important issue to the chamber. The announcement today that the easing of lockdown has in many w...
Alison Johnstone (Lothian) (Green) Green
I, too, thank Liz Smith for giving us the opportunity to discuss the threat that faces Scotland’s fantastic residential outdoor centres and the threat to the...
The Deputy Presiding Officer SNP
I call Richard Lochhead to respond to the debate for as long as he likes. 18:11
The Minister for Further Education, Higher Education and Science (Richard Lochhead) SNP
Thank you for that prompt, Presiding Officer. The Covid-19 pandemic has led to a very significant challenge for the entire education system in Scotland, but...
Liz Smith Con
I could not agree with the minister more. He is echoing exactly what every member said. Given the cross-party agreement on this, is the minister minded to ac...
Richard Lochhead SNP
I will take that on board, and I am coming to some of the steps that we could take. There is no doubt that outdoor centres support learners’ health and well...
Jamie Greene Con
Apologies to Mr Wightman—I believe it was a race to stand up there. Notwithstanding the financial pressures that all Governments are facing and the funds t...
Richard Lochhead SNP
As the member is aware, outdoor centres operate under a number of different models. Some are run by local authorities, some are third sector, some are privat...