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Chamber

Meeting of the Parliament (Hybrid) 03 June 2020

03 Jun 2020 · S5 · Meeting of the Parliament
Item of business
Scottish Elections (Reform) Bill

I start with the important points that Sarah Boyack and James Kelly made to the minister. It is important that we all understand that, today, the Electoral Commission said that it continues to recommend that all legislation relating to elections must be clear at least six months before it is required to be implemented or complied with. That includes this bill and any future legislative change that might be needed to accommodate or manage the next election to the Scottish Parliament, whether it takes place on schedule in May 2021, or whether it has to be delayed.

It is welcome that the minister has confirmed on the record his Government’s commitment to ensuring that that six-month timetable is complied with, no matter what. We cannot have exceptions to that. We know that we live in extraordinary times. We know that we are confronting an emergency, but we cannot make in a hurry emergency rules that change the way in which representative democracy and our elections are run in this country, pandemic or no pandemic. The Electoral Commission is unambiguous and I welcome what I have taken to be the minister’s equal unambiguity.

We have some time, because six months before next May is not until the end of this year. We have some time during the summer and the early autumn to ensure that our rules are fully in place six months before the election is held. I welcome the fact that that has been said clearly this afternoon.

I also welcome the way in which the minister has conducted himself throughout the passage of the bill.

I spoke about three aspects of the bill during the stage 1 debate, which was in early February but feels like a lifetime, if not a generation, ago. I will speak about two of those aspects today. The first is two-member and five-member council wards. As the law stands, all council wards in Scotland have either three or four councillors. The Islands (Scotland) Act 2018 allows the creation of one-member or two-member wards in the islands. Section 4 of the bill allows the creation of two-member, three-member, four-member or five-member wards in any council area in Scotland. That flexibility is welcome, but only to an extent. We all understand that that flexibility is not an unalloyed good and that, notwithstanding the fact that two-member wards, or indeed five-member wards, might be desirable in some areas that have strong community boundaries, they should not have them at the cost of undermining the proportionality between votes cast and seats won, on which the single transferable vote system that we use across Scotland for local government elections is based. Two-member wards make the achievement of that proportionality much more difficult, as Mark Ruskell said earlier.

In its valuable stage 1 report, the Standards, Procedures and Public Appointments Committee said that two-member wards should be used only in “very exceptional circumstances”. I agree with that. I welcome the way in which the provisions on the possible creation of two-member or five-member wards under section 4 of the bill have been strengthened during the passage of the bill by the Government amendments moved at stage 2 and those that were passed unanimously earlier this afternoon to require the Boundary Commission for Scotland to report in full to the Scottish Parliament about any future recommendations that it makes that any ward should be created that has only two or as many as five members.

Those are important steps in the right direction but all those steps, if they are taken at all, must be taken while bearing in mind that parties across the chamber want to see two or five-member council wards only in what the standards committee called “very exceptional circumstances”.

The final element of the bill that I want to reflect on, which has not been talked about this afternoon but is nonetheless important, is the setting at five years of term lengths for elections to this Parliament and to local government. I have not changed my mind since stage 1, when I said that I prefer four years to five years, but that boat has sailed—at least for the time being—because of the Fixed-term Parliaments Act 2011. The important thing here is not to have a largely futile argument about which—four or five years—is better but to ensure that there is clarity and certainty. Whenever we think about electoral law, the interests of the voters must be paramount. That is what the Electoral Commission is there for and why it says that all those rules, whatever they are, must be in place six months before the date of any election.

For as long as the Fixed-term Parliaments Act 2011 continues to fix the term of Westminster elections at five years, it makes sense for our term to be fixed at the same interval, so that there are not occasions when this Parliament and the United Kingdom Parliament are to be elected on the same day. However, as I said in the stage 1 debate, it is the policy of the party that won the most recent general election in the United Kingdom to repeal the Fixed-term Parliaments Act 2011. I am not yet clear what it proposes to replace the act with, but that important clarity and certainty needs to carry forward, irrespective of the fate of the 2011 act. We should not be wedded to five years out of principle, because there is no principle that says that five years is better than four years or any other relevant period. The important thing is to make sure that the interests of the voter are paramount at all times. We—or the Parliament that is elected at the next election, whenever that takes place—might need to revisit that and keep that option open, if and when the 2011 act is repealed.

16:02  

In the same item of business

The Deputy Presiding Officer (Christine Grahame) SNP
The next item of business is a debate on motion S5M-21891, in the name of Graeme Dey, on the Scottish Elections (Reform) Bill. I call Graeme Dey to speak to ...
The Minister for Parliamentary Business and Veterans (Graeme Dey) SNP
I thank everyone who has engaged with the Scottish Elections (Reform) Bill throughout its parliamentary passage. Many constructive contributions from all par...
Sarah Boyack (Lothian) (Lab) Lab
I very much agree with those points. The Electoral Commission has told us that it is really keen that the legislation is in place six months before it is nee...
Graeme Dey SNP
That is certainly the intention. Although we could not support Colin Smyth’s amendment earlier, I acknowledge how well intentioned it was. I am pleased that...
James Kelly (Glasgow) (Lab) Lab
I understand that the priority of the Government and everyone else is tackling issues around the pandemic. However, bearing in mind that the Electoral Commis...
Graeme Dey SNP
The work that is going on now will inform any decisions that require to be made further down the line by the Parliament. However, to give some assurance on M...
Adam Tomkins (Glasgow) (Con) Con
I start with the important points that Sarah Boyack and James Kelly made to the minister. It is important that we all understand that, today, the Electoral C...
Sarah Boyack (Lothian) (Lab) Lab
I too thank the clerks and all those who have given evidence to enable us to get a bill that, although it is not the longest, has important points that need ...
Mark Ruskell (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Green) Green
I will keep my comments on the bill relatively brief. However, as others have done, I thank the clerks and all those who gave evidence throughout the passage...
Willie Rennie (North East Fife) (LD) LD
I thank the clerks, the committee, the officials and witnesses as well as the advisers for their work on the bill. The minister is right in what he has said ...
Maureen Watt (Aberdeen South and North Kincardine) (SNP) SNP
I am pleased to speak in the stage 3 debate as the passage of the Scottish Elections (Reform) Bill nears its end. I, too, thank the bill team and the clerks ...
Alexander Stewart (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Con) Con
I am delighted to participate in the stage 3 debate on the Scottish Elections (Reform) Bill. The proposals in the bill make some sensible changes to the Scot...
James Kelly (Glasgow) (Lab) Lab
I rise to speak in favour of the bill, which Scottish Labour will support at decision time. As Mark Ruskell said, the bill is largely technical, but there a...
Stuart McMillan (Greenock and Inverclyde) (SNP) SNP
I do not want to sound too party political, but we should bear it in mind that, at the time, the United Kingdom Government had responsibility for elections i...
James Kelly Lab
I do not think that that was a helpful intervention, to be honest. I will mention some of the other aspects of the bill. It is important that the provisions...
Bill Kidd (Glasgow Anniesland) (SNP) SNP
As the convener of the Standards, Procedures and Public Appointments Committee, I have worked with colleagues over months on the shared goal of strengthening...
The Deputy Presiding Officer SNP
We move to the closing speeches. 16:33
Neil Findlay (Lothian) (Lab) Lab
I echo the words of the convener of the Standards, Procedures and Public Appointments Committee and express my solidarity with all those who are protesting a...
Richard Lyle (Uddingston and Bellshill) (SNP) SNP
We’ll no be here.
Neil Findlay Lab
Exactly. It is very important for Mr Lyle and me that that election happens on time. Some people might not want it to, but I hope that, in summing up, the mi...
The Deputy Presiding Officer SNP
Thank you very much, Mr Findlay. I must be feeling ill because I see that you and Richard Lyle agreed with each other. I will need to keep taking my pills. ...
Jamie Halcro Johnston (Highlands and Islands) (Con) Con
We have missed out on the opportunity to have a Findlay-Lyle pact, but maybe that is still to come. It is welcome to pick up the bill again for stage 3. I t...
Graeme Dey SNP
I thank members for their contributions to the debate. Before I turn to some of the points that have been raised, I record my appreciation for the efforts of...
Richard Lyle SNP
I welcome the fact that—as I hope is the case—the minister is about to announce that the situation with regard to candidates’ addresses is about to be review...
Graeme Dey SNP
I indicated to the committee that I plan to make changes by secondary legislation to address those legitimate points. We will not face a council by-election ...
The Presiding Officer (Ken Macintosh) NPA
That concludes our stage 3 debate on the Scottish Elections (Reform) Bill.