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Chamber

Meeting of the Parliament 21 January 2020

21 Jan 2020 · S5 · Meeting of the Parliament
Item of business
Scottish National Investment Bank Bill

I thank all those who have contributed to the forging of the bill: the advisers, the committee, the ministers for their constructive behaviour, and Benny Higgins for his contribution.

The ambitions are big. That is certainly true. The language that is used to describe the bill is sometimes glorious; it will, for example, “transform our imagination”. I am looking forward to that particular event. The expectations are high for reshaping our economy. People will expect that to be delivered, so the responsibilities on all of us to make it happen are keen, especially when the challenges are so great—in particular on climate change and the green economy, which Andy Wightman talked about.

It is important that we use the bank to lever that change, and that we use it in relation to productivity. When we look at the stubborn problems that we have, it is unbelievable that companies that create offshore wind farms have to go, or are choosing to go, to other parts of the world—sometimes the other side of the planet—instead of constructing jackets and other turbine elements in this country. What are we getting wrong? Why are we not making that work? What are the steps that we need to take? What are the investments that we need to have? Who are the business leaders whom we need to have in place to make all that happen? Perhaps the bank will play a role in making sure that all that comes together. Who would take the risk of transporting jackets all the way across the globe, with the extra cost of doing that, instead of building them here? Let us rise to that challenge and make sure that we exploit the great opportunity of the energy off our shores.

There are massive challenges in how we cope with our waste. We have seen the delay in the landfill ban. There is an awful lot of infrastructure that we need to build in order to cope with the waste that we are generating in this country.

Our world-class universities—which are among the best, obviously—are producing a huge amount of intellectual property. We still fail to exploit that intellectual property fully for the benefit of people here, and to create jobs, wealth and opportunities.

The bank has many challenges to play a part in and, of course, it does not have all the answers. We need to learn the lessons of previous projects, such as the Scottish growth scheme. That was supposed to be a great game changer for the businesses and economy of this country, with £0.5 billion of investment. It has not been fully utilised; we need to make sure that the SNIB is.

The Green Investment Bank across the UK—in whose setting up we had a role, although to our great disappointment it was privatised later—was making good progress. We should draw on the expertise that was developed through it. What has our own Scottish Investment Bank done, through Scottish Enterprise, that works, that can succeed and that we can build on for greater success?

My final comment is that there will be great temptation from us in the chamber and people further afield to put pressure on the bank at a time of great pressure on the economy, when much-loved businesses are under great stress and perhaps on their way out. Perhaps they do not have a future; perhaps they are failing businesses. There might be a great temptation for us to pressure the bank into propping up those failing businesses. Nobody wants to see them go, but sometimes we need to ensure that we put the investment into new opportunities and challenges that will create many more jobs.

Of course, the bank should listen to Parliament and should understand what we believe are the political priorities for this country. However, it should also have the freedom to act as it thinks best, so that it can lever in money to create jobs and opportunities, and create the low-carbon green economy for the future of our country and the planet.

In the same item of business

The Presiding Officer (Ken Macintosh) NPA
The next item of business is a stage 3 debate on motion S5M-20514, in the name of Derek Mackay, on the Scottish National Investment Bank Bill. I invite membe...
The Cabinet Secretary for Finance, Economy and Fair Work (Derek Mackay) SNP
I am delighted to open this stage 3 debate on the Scottish national investment bank. The Economy, Energy and Fair Work Committee heard about the bank’s pote...
Neil Findlay (Lothian) (Lab) Lab
Will the cabinet secretary take an intervention?
Derek Mackay SNP
No, thank you. The First Minister has committed to the bank’s primary mission being supporting the just transition to net zero carbon emissions. Harnessing ...
Neil Findlay Lab
Will the cabinet secretary take an intervention?
Derek Mackay SNP
No, thank you. The bill demonstrates Scotland’s ambition for transforming our economy and tackling major societal challenges. Passing the bill today will ma...
Dean Lockhart (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Con) Con
I, too, thank the Economy, Energy and Fair Work Committee’s clerking team, the witnesses and all those who gave evidence during the passage of the bill. I th...
Derek Mackay SNP
Yes.
Dean Lockhart Con
I thank the cabinet secretary very much for his brief and positive answer. Following the establishment of the bank, another priority will be for the taxpaye...
Neil Findlay Lab
Dean Lockhart sat through the committee stages of the bill. It would be remiss of us not to raise concerns, which have been mentioned in the media, including...
Dean Lockhart Con
I am not sure whether Neil Findlay has seen the correspondence between the committee and the cabinet secretary, but I would encourage him to look at it, beca...
Richard Leonard (Central Scotland) (Lab) Lab
I genuinely believe that today is an important day in the history of this Parliament. A quarter of a century ago, I was calling, on behalf of the Scottish tr...
Andy Wightman (Lothian) (Green) Green
I thank the cabinet secretary for his on-going engagement on the bill in the Economy, Energy and Fair Work Committee and for keeping committee members inform...
Willie Rennie (North East Fife) (LD) LD
I thank all those who have contributed to the forging of the bill: the advisers, the committee, the ministers for their constructive behaviour, and Benny Hig...
The Deputy Presiding Officer (Linda Fabiani) SNP
We move to the open debate. Speeches should be no longer than four minutes, please. 17:00
Alex Neil (Airdrie and Shotts) (SNP) SNP
To pick up on one of Willie Rennie’s points, I say that the bank’s emphasis has to be on preparing Scotland for tomorrow’s world, not on dealing with the con...
The Deputy Presiding Officer SNP
Speeches should be of no more than four minutes, please. 17:05
Gordon Lindhurst (Lothian) (Con) Con
We are agreed that national investment banks can play a valuable role in facilitating economic growth. I am not sure that I understood—or misunderstood—Alex ...
Jackie Baillie (Dumbarton) (Lab) Lab
I support having a Scottish national investment bank. It is fair to say that it has been a long time in coming. I think that John Swinney—clearly behind Rich...
Jackie Baillie Lab
Oh! There we go.
Dean Lockhart Con
I did not catch the beginning of her statement, but if Jackie Baillie is asking whether more money will be coming from the UK Government as part of the budge...
Jackie Baillie Lab
I am asking very specifically whether financial transaction money will come after March 2021 to fund the SNIB. Is it a yes or a no?
Dean Lockhart Con
The money is fungible—
Jackie Baillie Lab
Yes or no? He cannot reply.
The Deputy Presiding Officer SNP
Mr Lockhart is speaking, Ms Baillie.
Jackie Baillie Lab
It is my speech, Presiding Officer.
Dean Lockhart Con
The money is fungible. It is up to the cabinet secretary to decide how to use the increased funding that is coming from the UK Government.
Jackie Baillie Lab
That explains why I am concerned about the continuing uncertainty. We did not hear anything to reassure us. Let me finish on a note of consensus. I am grate...
Colin Beattie (Midlothian North and Musselburgh) (SNP) SNP
Jackie Baillie was actually making a good case for independence with her arguments about funding. I welcome the establishment of the Scottish national inves...
The Deputy Presiding Officer SNP
We move to the closing speeches. 17:19