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Chamber

Meeting of the Parliament 21 January 2020

21 Jan 2020 · S5 · Meeting of the Parliament
Item of business
Scottish National Investment Bank Bill
Lockhart, Dean Con Mid Scotland and Fife Watch on SPTV

I, too, thank the Economy, Energy and Fair Work Committee’s clerking team, the witnesses and all those who gave evidence during the passage of the bill. I thank Benny Higgins and the implementation team for their excellent work during the implementation period, and I again thank the cabinet secretary and his team for the constructive manner in which they have engaged during the legislative process.

We have supported the establishment of the bank at all stages of the bill. We agree with the underlying objectives for establishing the bank: that there is a need for more long-term, patient capital; that businesses in Scotland need more help to expand; and that we need a transformational change in Scotland’s economy.

Development banks across the world have shown that that is possible. However, the transformational change will happen only if the development bank is part of a coherent economic policy framework in which there is absolute clarity on the economic strategy and objectives.

The cabinet secretary will not be surprised to hear me say that there is still much work to be done in that respect, as was recognised in the chamber in a previous debate when an all-party motion recognised that

“a cluttered policy landscape can lead to confusion, a lack of alignment, duplication and weakened accountability”.

The concerns about the enterprise landscape were also highlighted at the committee when one witness referred to it as a “Venn diagram on steroids”. That is our overriding concern about the bank’s future success: the bank is being introduced into a confused and cluttered enterprise landscape. To be fair to the cabinet secretary, I think that he recognises that. In his letter to the Economy, Energy and Fair Work Committee of 10 January, he confirmed that

“Wider work is on-going to develop and cement the future relationship between the new Bank and the Scottish economic development ecosystem”.

The success of the transition will be vital to the success of the bank. Will the cabinet secretary commit to providing regular updates to the chamber and the committee about the changes that he will be making as part of the transition?

In the same item of business

The Presiding Officer (Ken Macintosh) NPA
The next item of business is a stage 3 debate on motion S5M-20514, in the name of Derek Mackay, on the Scottish National Investment Bank Bill. I invite membe...
The Cabinet Secretary for Finance, Economy and Fair Work (Derek Mackay) SNP
I am delighted to open this stage 3 debate on the Scottish national investment bank. The Economy, Energy and Fair Work Committee heard about the bank’s pote...
Neil Findlay (Lothian) (Lab) Lab
Will the cabinet secretary take an intervention?
Derek Mackay SNP
No, thank you. The First Minister has committed to the bank’s primary mission being supporting the just transition to net zero carbon emissions. Harnessing ...
Neil Findlay Lab
Will the cabinet secretary take an intervention?
Derek Mackay SNP
No, thank you. The bill demonstrates Scotland’s ambition for transforming our economy and tackling major societal challenges. Passing the bill today will ma...
Dean Lockhart (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Con) Con
I, too, thank the Economy, Energy and Fair Work Committee’s clerking team, the witnesses and all those who gave evidence during the passage of the bill. I th...
Derek Mackay SNP
Yes.
Dean Lockhart Con
I thank the cabinet secretary very much for his brief and positive answer. Following the establishment of the bank, another priority will be for the taxpaye...
Neil Findlay Lab
Dean Lockhart sat through the committee stages of the bill. It would be remiss of us not to raise concerns, which have been mentioned in the media, including...
Dean Lockhart Con
I am not sure whether Neil Findlay has seen the correspondence between the committee and the cabinet secretary, but I would encourage him to look at it, beca...
Richard Leonard (Central Scotland) (Lab) Lab
I genuinely believe that today is an important day in the history of this Parliament. A quarter of a century ago, I was calling, on behalf of the Scottish tr...
Andy Wightman (Lothian) (Green) Green
I thank the cabinet secretary for his on-going engagement on the bill in the Economy, Energy and Fair Work Committee and for keeping committee members inform...
Willie Rennie (North East Fife) (LD) LD
I thank all those who have contributed to the forging of the bill: the advisers, the committee, the ministers for their constructive behaviour, and Benny Hig...
The Deputy Presiding Officer (Linda Fabiani) SNP
We move to the open debate. Speeches should be no longer than four minutes, please. 17:00
Alex Neil (Airdrie and Shotts) (SNP) SNP
To pick up on one of Willie Rennie’s points, I say that the bank’s emphasis has to be on preparing Scotland for tomorrow’s world, not on dealing with the con...
The Deputy Presiding Officer SNP
Speeches should be of no more than four minutes, please. 17:05
Gordon Lindhurst (Lothian) (Con) Con
We are agreed that national investment banks can play a valuable role in facilitating economic growth. I am not sure that I understood—or misunderstood—Alex ...
Jackie Baillie (Dumbarton) (Lab) Lab
I support having a Scottish national investment bank. It is fair to say that it has been a long time in coming. I think that John Swinney—clearly behind Rich...
Jackie Baillie Lab
Oh! There we go.
Dean Lockhart Con
I did not catch the beginning of her statement, but if Jackie Baillie is asking whether more money will be coming from the UK Government as part of the budge...
Jackie Baillie Lab
I am asking very specifically whether financial transaction money will come after March 2021 to fund the SNIB. Is it a yes or a no?
Dean Lockhart Con
The money is fungible—
Jackie Baillie Lab
Yes or no? He cannot reply.
The Deputy Presiding Officer SNP
Mr Lockhart is speaking, Ms Baillie.
Jackie Baillie Lab
It is my speech, Presiding Officer.
Dean Lockhart Con
The money is fungible. It is up to the cabinet secretary to decide how to use the increased funding that is coming from the UK Government.
Jackie Baillie Lab
That explains why I am concerned about the continuing uncertainty. We did not hear anything to reassure us. Let me finish on a note of consensus. I am grate...
Colin Beattie (Midlothian North and Musselburgh) (SNP) SNP
Jackie Baillie was actually making a good case for independence with her arguments about funding. I welcome the establishment of the Scottish national inves...
The Deputy Presiding Officer SNP
We move to the closing speeches. 17:19