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Chamber

Meeting of the Parliament 14 January 2020

14 Jan 2020 · S5 · Meeting of the Parliament
Item of business
Improving the Lives of Gypsy Travellers

I make the commitment today that any form of racism or discrimination would not be tolerated by the Scottish Conservatives.

The impact of on-going discrimination on Gypsy Travellers is well documented. Many people in that community are alienated from public services, which is one reason why I support the action plan’s focus on the vital role of local government in improving the lives of Gypsy Travellers. If they are to engage with public services, the solutions must be at a local level, because obvious barriers remain in place. Many Gypsy Travellers come from a culture that is self-reliant. Others in that community will have no permanent address. We will reach and help those people only through a plan that begins and ends with local government taking the lead.

It is clear that marginalisation is having a real impact on those communities. Basic health needs are not being met. Many Gypsy Travellers face difficulties when trying to visit a GP, and we know from the evidence that some will travel as far as 300 miles to see a dentist or doctor who they trust and who they know will see them.

Those are key reasons why Gypsy Travellers experience inexcusable health inequalities and lower life expectancy. The age profile of Gypsy Travellers is much younger than that of the population as a whole. Only 28 per cent of the community’s population are aged 45 and over, compared with 44 per cent of the population of Scotland as a whole. I welcome the joint action plan’s approach to tackling those problems by delivering joined-up services and through collaboration between the national health service and community partners across the north-east and Dumfries and Galloway.

We see a similar pattern in education, in which outcomes were the worst for Gypsy Traveller families. An analysis of the 2011 census found that half of Gypsy Travellers aged 16 or over had no qualifications, when the figure for the whole of Scotland was 27 per cent; only 16 per cent of Gypsy Travellers held qualifications of level 4 or above, compared to 26 per cent of the population as a whole; and 38 per cent of Gypsy Travellers aged 16 to 24 were full-time students compared to 46 per cent of the general population in that age group. Clearly, we must do more to provide the community with flexible learning alternatives. I am also pleased that the joint action plan seeks to deal with that issue and that it references the Gypsy Traveller education group in South Lanarkshire, which has expanded provision for local kids.

There are also housing issues to deal with in the Gypsy Traveller community. There is evidence that minimum standards have not been achieved at council-assigned sites. At times, housing has been built in undesirable or unsafe locations such as unpopular brownfield sites. We have also heard that sites experience issues with dampness, mould and access to water. I therefore welcome the fact that the joint action plan will deliver a review of housing and investment programmes by March 2021, which I hope will ensure that all Gypsy Traveller accommodation meets standards and is fully considered in local housing policy.

The action plan seeks to ensure equality of opportunity for all of Scotland’s Gypsy Travellers. As we have heard, it focuses on five key areas: providing more and better accommodation; improving access to public services; maximising household incomes; tackling racism and discrimination; and strengthening community development and engagement. As we have heard, the involvement of the Gypsy Traveller community is even more important than having local leaders. Any solution to the discrimination that Gypsy Travellers face and the problems that they incur in accessing services must be implemented alongside that community.

The plan also states that consideration will be given to what further data we require, which is an issue that I have raised previously. I hope that the data will be developed quickly so that we can see more clearly where the problems lie and what actions are having a positive impact. The issue might sound inconsequential compared with some of the problems that Gypsy Travellers face, but there is no doubt that more accurate recording and measurement of data would help the community over the long term.

I welcome the Scottish Government’s work so far and I hope that we will start to see progress for a group that has too often been left behind.

14:51  

In the same item of business

The Presiding Officer (Ken Macintosh) NPA
The next item of business is a debate on motion S5M-20404, in the name of Christina McKelvie, on improving the lives of Gypsy Travellers. Members who wish to...
The Minister for Older People and Equalities (Christina McKelvie) SNP
The Presiding Officer has given me a promotion.
The Presiding Officer NPA
I apologise. I meant to say “the minister”. 14:25
The Minister for Older People and Equalities (Christina McKelvie) SNP
Thank you, Presiding Officer. I am delighted to bring the motion to the chamber for debate. This is an important opportunity for members of all parties to co...
John Finnie (Highlands and Islands) (Green) Green
I am grateful to the minister for taking an intervention. I am delighted to hear her use the words “home” and “accommodation”. Does she agree that that is ve...
Christina McKelvie SNP
I am pleased, and members will hear much more about the change in language. We identified that we needed to ask whether our policy demonstrated, in its langu...
Mary Fee (West Scotland) (Lab) Lab
I am grateful to the minister for taking an intervention on that. The minister will be aware that each local authority has a Gypsy Traveller liaison officer....
Christina McKelvie SNP
Absolutely. We have already been working with the Gypsy Traveller liaison officers in order that they can feed into and be an integral part of the process. T...
Mary Fee Lab
That would be helpful.
Christina McKelvie SNP
I will be happy to update Mary Fee as soon as I can. Alongside the local leaders network, the Scottish Government will work with the Gypsy Traveller communi...
Annie Wells (Glasgow) (Con) Con
I thank the Scottish Government for bringing forward this important and timely debate on Gypsy Travellers and how we can support them. I commend Christina Mc...
John Finnie Green
The member mentioned the nomadic lifestyle, which is not just within the boundaries of Scotland but outwith them. I hope that the member will mention the con...
Annie Wells Con
I will reflect on what the minister said and write to her with my views on that. Regardless of their language, customs or everyday way of life, every group ...
The Minister for Local Government, Housing and Planning (Kevin Stewart) SNP
I am glad that Ms Wells says that none of us wants any attack on the Gypsy Traveller community. However, I am concerned about the fact that racism is often e...
Annie Wells Con
I make the commitment today that any form of racism or discrimination would not be tolerated by the Scottish Conservatives. The impact of on-going discrimin...
Mary Fee (West Scotland) (Lab) Lab
As a long-term advocate for Gypsy Travellers, I am delighted that such an important debate is taking place. In opening for Scottish Labour, I thank the Scott...
The Presiding Officer NPA
I call John Finnie to open the debate for the Scottish Green Party. 15:00
John Finnie (Highlands and Islands) (Green) Green
I join other members in thanking the Scottish Government for bringing the debate to the chamber, and the minister for her opening speech. Indeed, I thank bot...
Kevin Stewart SNP
I will intervene briefly to do so. I say to Mr Finnie that Mr Russell is regularly on at me about the situation in Argyll and Bute. Mr Finnie is right to poi...
John Finnie Green
I have been at the minister’s door a few times and I have always had a courteous listening. In relation to the situation that I mentioned, I do not know whet...
The Deputy Presiding Officer (Linda Fabiani) SNP
You can have another couple of minutes, if you like.
John Finnie Green
That is very kind of you. People will be aware of the abuse that the Roma community is putting up with across Europe, and the draconian laws that are being ...
The Deputy Presiding Officer SNP
I call Alex Cole-Hamilton. You have a generous six, seven or eight minutes. 15:09
Alex Cole-Hamilton (Edinburgh Western) (LD) LD
You are always generous, Presiding Officer. I am very grateful to the Government for bringing its motion to the Parliament today and for the publication of ...
The Deputy Presiding Officer SNP
We move to the open debate. Speeches should be of around six minutes, please, but we have a little time in hand for interventions, if members would like to t...
Fulton MacGregor (Coatbridge and Chryston) (SNP) SNP
As has been the case with other members, it gives me great pleasure to speak in this afternoon’s debate on Scotland’s Gypsy Travellers. I welcome the publica...
Jamie Greene (West Scotland) (Con) Con
I thank colleagues for their contributions thus far in the debate. It is a topic of great interest and passion to many; that is evident from the speeches tha...
Kevin Stewart SNP
Will Jamie Greene give way?
Jamie Greene Con
I will give way in a second; I would like to paint a picture of the landscape first. In 38 per cent of stories, a connection to criminality was made, and 3...
Kevin Stewart SNP
As Mr Finnie has already highlighted, many media outlets have an agenda when it comes to dealing with Gypsy Traveller issues. However, I point out that they ...