Hansard

I thank colleagues for their thoughtful and constructive contributions to this afternoon’s debate. MSPs across the chamber have made powerful and thought-provoking comments. The cabinet secretary and I will reflect on those important points.

It is important to put on record that my colleague Sandra White, who has the Glasgow School of Art in her constituency, would have been here today to make a forceful contribution on the subject, but, as we all know, she cannot be here with us, for understandable reasons. Our thoughts are certainly with her this week.

As Minister for Further Education, Higher Education and Science, my first obligation is, naturally, to ensure the highest-quality learning experience for students in Scotland. Therefore, I am pleased that, despite the impact of these two dreadful fires, the Glasgow School of Art has continued to attract the brightest and best from across the world while nurturing the best of Scotland’s talent and contributing energy and passion to our vital creative industries in this country. As I said in my opening remarks, the Glasgow School of Art ranks in the top 10 art and design institutions in the QS World University Rankings 2019.

James Kelly spoke about being in Glasgow on the day of the fire and experiencing at first hand the public’s response to the devastation; and I recall following the story on social media when the news broke, finding it hard to comprehend the scale of the devastation. As Annabelle Ewing said, the community is still trying to come to terms with the scale of the loss.

Therefore, it is important that we use the opportunity to learn lessons from those fires, to ensure that, as much as they can be, our iconic, historic buildings are protected. Having met GSA’s acting chair, Professor Nora Kearney, yesterday, I know that the board strongly agrees.

Members have referred to a number of recommendations to the Glasgow School of Art, including that it should: consider putting the Mackintosh building into a trust; review how it presents information on its website—specifically, information related to items lost during the 2014 and 2018 fires—be more transparent in its processes, particularly in relation to any rebuild of the Mack; in consultation with the local community, establish formal methods of communication; and, before deciding the future of the Mack, undertake a full consultation exercise.

In the body of its excellent report, the committee also calls into question: the school’s approach to risk management; the capacity and expertise of the board and the priority it gave to safeguarding the building; the length of time taken to install the mist suppression system; and the school’s ability to articulate the lessons that it learned as a result of the 2014 fire.

A number of issues were raised. I am not the Glasgow School of Art and I am not responsible for many of those issues. I cannot respond to them all. Some have to be put in context. Of course, we must bear in mind that the contractor had day-to-day control of the site. The committee acknowledged that the school had oversight arrangements in place for that. Patrick Harvie mentioned not having access to the insurance policy. Our understanding is that the insurers did not give their consent to release that, because the claims are not closed. I am giving context for some of the points, because, at this stage, we do not know some of the answers to many of the issues that were raised.

The GSA is an autonomous body. Its board has responsibility for strategic decision making and ensuring operational efficiency. It has responded to many of the criticisms that have been made today.

It has made clear its intention—in principle—to rebuild the Mackintosh building. It has committed to review how it disseminates and shares information and to appoint a dedicated community engagement officer to support its efforts to build trust with its neighbours.

I recognise the concerns that members across the chamber have expressed about the need for trust and transparency and to give greater focus to a more positive relationship with the local community. During my meeting yesterday with management, a large part of our conversation was focused on that subject. The management team gave me many assurances and guarantees that it will be much higher up the agenda and that it recognises the concerns raised by local members and in the committee’s report.

On the question of a trust, the board has been clear that the Mackintosh building is core to what makes the Glasgow School of Art experience unique. As I said in my opening remarks and other members referred to, the board sees it not just as a building but as part of the teaching experience—as a tool for teaching in itself. However, the GSA has said that it will consider all options for the management of the building.

Of course, I am aware of the genuine and widespread concern raised in the press and in public discourse about decisions that the school of art has made in the years since the 2014 fire. It is not for ministers to pre-empt the outcome of the fire investigation or to form a view on the fire prevention strategies that have been employed during the rebuild project. However, as I said before, in some areas, we have to put things into context, with regard to who was in charge of the site on a day-to-day basis, when the second fire took place.

There have also been concerns around the use of public funding. The Scottish Government pledged £5 million in the wake of the 2014 fire, in order to support GSA to restore the Mackintosh building to its former glory. The phoenix bursary fund provided an extra £750,000 to support up to 102 final-year students to recreate their work. The UK Government provided £5 million for the purchase of the former Stow College building.

With regard to the debate that has taken place around the funding, the restoration of the damaged west wing was covered by the art school’s insurance. However, in consultation with Historic Environment Scotland, the decision was taken to include the whole building in the restoration works, in order to ensure the integrity and safety of building-wide systems and to ensure that the whole building was fit for purpose.

Therefore, we ministers are satisfied that the GSA spent the money that was provided by the Scottish Government in the way that was intended, given the need to extend the refurbishment beyond those parts of the building that were damaged by the fire and covered by the insurance.

I recognise that members are also concerned about the use of funds raised through public donations, which was mentioned by a few members in the debate. I understand that the Scottish Fundraising Standards Panel is considering that matter at the moment, in light of many reports in the media. I have no evidence of any impropriety, but that investigation is taking place in response to the media coverage and there is, therefore, no more information that ministers can give in response to that concern at the moment.

Of course, the committee’s recommendations impact more widely than simply on the Glasgow School of Art. As I mentioned earlier, Historic Environment Scotland’s statutory remit in relation to fire mitigation in buildings of outstanding special architectural or historic interest will be considered by the Government. In addition, the agency will review and strengthen its guidance on the risks to buildings during conservation and renovation work and its technical guidance on fire safety management. Another feature of this debate is that many such fires take place in buildings when they are under construction. That is a vulnerable period and those issues are important, which is why members are raising them. All of that is important work to safeguard our heritage buildings in Scotland, and we will have to take into account the findings of the Scottish Fire and Rescue Service’s investigations, once those are complete.

Given the time available, I will move on to the issue of the public inquiry, for which many members have forcefully made the case. I will repeat what I said before; it is absolutely right that we await the outcome of the investigations that are under way before giving further consideration to the committee’s recommendation to establish a public inquiry. The Government has not ruled out a public inquiry, but there are clearly many different factors to weigh up prior to taking any decision. No decision can even be contemplated until we know the detail of the SFRS’s investigations. That will provide us with a lot more evidence, which will enable us to take the right decisions moving forward.

In conclusion, I urge all organisations with responsibility for the upkeep and preservation of the many fantastic historic buildings that we have in Scotland to take heed of the detailed and valuable findings of the committee’s thorough and powerful report. I thank fellow MSPs again for their contributions to the debate, on which I and colleagues in the Government will certainly reflect.