Chamber
Meeting of the Parliament 18 September 2019
18 Sep 2019 · S5 · Meeting of the Parliament
Item of business
Criminal Sentencing
I move amendment S5M-18896.3, to leave out from “believes” to end and insert:
“, while acknowledging that more can always be done to ensure that public confidence in the justice system is high, notes that a recent survey conducted on behalf of the Scottish Sentencing Council found that nearly two thirds of the public considered that Scotland’s justice system was fair to all; further notes that automatic early release was introduced by the UK Government in 1993, and that the previous system of automatic early release for long-term prisoners was ended by the Scottish Parliament from 2016, and considers that future reforms to sentencing policy should be informed by evidence of what works to reduce reoffending and take appropriate account of Scotland’s current internationally high rate of imprisonment.”
16:04References in this contribution
Motions, questions or amendments mentioned by their reference code.
In the same item of business
The Deputy Presiding Officer (Christine Grahame)
SNP
The next item of business is a debate on motion S5M-18896, in the name of Liam Kerr, on restoring trust in criminal sentencing. 15:51
Liam Kerr (North East Scotland) (Con)
Con
I have lodged this motion because I am sure that all of us in the chamber have met victims and their families who have expressed disbelief and horror at what...
The Deputy Presiding Officer
SNP
Excuse me, Mr Kerr. This is a quiet chamber at the moment, and I can hear Mr Neil’s and Mr Lyle’s conversation at the back of the room. They cannot hear me, ...
Liam Kerr
Con
Thank you, Presiding Officer. That is the reality, because every criminal who is sentenced to under four years in jail is automatically released halfway th...
Daniel Johnson (Edinburgh Southern) (Lab)
Lab
Can the member enlighten us about which Government introduced that automatic release measure ?
Liam Kerr
Con
I am happy to. It was introduced by the Conservative Government, which was seeking to wind it up in 1997 when a Labour Government came in and did not bother....
The Cabinet Secretary for Justice (Humza Yousaf)
SNP
Liam Kerr mentioned the horrific case of the brutal murder of Alesha MacPhail. Does he recognise that his own proposed bill for whole-life custody, which is ...
The Deputy Presiding Officer
SNP
Before Mr Kerr rises, I note that I have time in hand, so members need not be concerned about interventions—during the early part of the debate, at least.
Liam Kerr
Con
I understand the cabinet secretary’s point, and I will come back to whole-life sentences—he should have no fear of that. The point that I am making is abou...
The Cabinet Secretary for Justice (Humza Yousaf)
SNP
Although I disagree with his motion—to which we have, of course, lodged an amendment—I thank Liam Kerr for bringing today’s debate. It is an important debate...
Liam Kerr
Con
Will the cabinet secretary take an intervention?
Humza Yousaf
SNP
I was about to quote from a speech that Lady Dorrian gave, but I will give way to Liam Kerr before I do so.
Liam Kerr
Con
I am grateful to the cabinet secretary for taking my intervention, but I am concerned about what he said about automatic early release. Does he think that it...
Humza Yousaf
SNP
Abolishing automatic early release for short-term prisoners is not the right thing at all. A couple of days ago, I was questioned about—
Liam Kerr
Con
Will the cabinet secretary take a further intervention?
Humza Yousaf
SNP
No, I will not. I ask Mr Kerr to give me a second to develop my point. Yesterday in the chamber, I took questions about our prison population, which I think ...
Liam Kerr
Con
The cabinet secretary will recall that, in 2006, he gave The Herald a quote to the effect that he was in favour of abolishing automatic early release. I am t...
Humza Yousaf
SNP
First of all, whatever I said then in The Herald would have been about abolishing automatic early release for long-term prisoners, which the Parliament chose...
The Deputy Presiding Officer
SNP
You must conclude there.
Humza Yousaf
SNP
However, I look forward to hearing the rest of the debate.
The Deputy Presiding Officer
SNP
Please move your amendment, cabinet secretary
Humza Yousaf
SNP
I move amendment S5M-18896.3, to leave out from “believes” to end and insert: “, while acknowledging that more can always be done to ensure that public conf...
James Kelly (Glasgow) (Lab)
Lab
I welcome the opportunity to speak in this Conservative business debate, which has been brought to the chamber by Liam Kerr. I am not closed to the idea of ...
Margaret Mitchell (Central Scotland) (Con)
Con
Will the member take an intervention?
James Kelly
Lab
I am a bit short of time. I am sorry.
The Deputy Presiding Officer
SNP
I can give you the time back if you want to take the intervention, Mr Kelly.
James Kelly
Lab
Yes—sure.
Margaret Mitchell
Con
I thank the member. Does he recognise that the remand population, which includes people who should not be on remand, is the area that we should be looking at...
James Kelly
Lab
There are different ways to look at reducing the prison population—some of them have come up in recent days—but if we consider the central thrust of Liam Ker...
John Finnie (Highlands and Islands) (Green)
Green
Mr Kerr has brought a philosophical debate to the chamber. I have to say that I increasingly find Mr Kerr’s views distasteful. I am not convinced that they a...