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Committee

Rural Economy and Connectivity Committee 12 June 2019

12 Jun 2019 · S5 · Rural Economy and Connectivity Committee
Item of business
Transport (Scotland) Bill: Stage 2
Amendment 207 relates to the grant-making powers of ministers. Currently, ministers may make grants to help local authorities operate a scheme. The amendment would provide that ministers may help local authorities to meet the costs of the revocation of a scheme, particularly in light of the amendments in my name that we debated last week that were not agreed to, which would have taken away from ministers the power to revoke schemes. Given that ministers still have the power to revoke schemes, they should also have the power to help local authorities meet the cost of revocation. A practical example might be help with the costs of uninstalling approved devices, infrastructure and cameras and the costs that are associated with closing down the administration of the operation of a scheme, including redundancy and staffing costs. My understanding is that grants that are made available under section 19 would be mutually agreed between ministers and local authorities and therefore not unilaterally determined by Scottish ministers, which is what is currently stated in the bill. Amendment 208 would ensure equity of agreement of the conditions of the grants to ensure that local authorities are not obliged to enter into financial agreements with ministers without first having agreed to the amount and the terms. I seek some clarity from the minister as to why, as the bill is drafted, the grant would require repayment. Does that not mean that it would be classed as a loan, rather than a grant? A grant implies that there would be no terms of repayment of either the capital or the interest. Amendment 209 on revenues achieved by local authorities is important. One would assume that there will be surplus revenue after the operating costs in each local authority that operates a zone are deducted. In my view, such revenue should be used to improve and encourage low-carbon and carbon-free travel in the zone. For example, revenue that is collected from people who are breaching the rules of the zone could be used to fund schemes such as cycle lanes or electric charging points in our cities. My view has always been that penalty charges should not simply be a revenue-generating source for low-emission zones and part of their wider financial pot but should be a true deterrent to non-compliant vehicles entering the zone. Penalising such behaviour could create the necessary funds to build the low and no-carbon infrastructure in the zones that is required to meet the modal shift that we desperately need in those cities. Agreeing to amendment 209 would mean that drivers could rest assured that LEZs are not just a tax on drivers simply for the sake of it and that the revenues achieved would build sustainable, low-carbon transport infrastructure. I am very open to the amendment being reworded as members see fit, but I hope that we agree that the revenues that are generated by low-emission zones should be put to good use, such as to promote sustainable and active travel. Again, I am interested to hear the Government’s response to that. Amendment 211 is to do with reporting requirements. Section 23 stipulates that an annual report must be published before the end of the financial year in which the zone began operating. However, at the moment, there is little guidance about the necessary content of that report. Amendment 211 would oblige local authorities to include specific pieces of information, such as the total costs of proposing, creating and operating a scheme, and the gross and net revenues achieved, in annual reports. More important, proposed new subsection (c) would require information to be included on “how the revenue has been used to facilitate the achievement of the scheme’s objectives.” At the moment, the Scottish ministers may give direction to a local authority to carry out a review of an LEZ scheme. That is a sensible approach, but amendment 212 would give local authorities the technical ability to carry out a review of a zone, its operation and effectiveness at any given time, as it sees fit, without any prior direction from the Government, if it chooses to do so. Allowing a local authority to review the effectiveness of a low-emission zone would help identify any weaknesses in the structure of its zone and give it the opportunity to improve it. I think that developing low-emission zones over the years will be a critical part in assuring their long-term success. I hope that members think that giving local authorities the ability to carry out such reviews as they deem fit would be a useful additional power. I move amendment 207.

In the same item of business

The Convener Con
We are continuing our consideration of stage 2 amendments to the Transport (Scotland) Bill. Today’s meeting will be in two parts. We will meet this morning u...
The Convener Con
The first group is on low-emission zones and parking prohibitions: removal of approved devices. Amendment 59, in the name of the cabinet secretary, is groupe...
The Cabinet Secretary for Transport, Infrastructure and Connectivity (Michael Matheson) SNP
Section 15 allows traffic authorities to install and maintain approved devices for the operation and detection procedure for the LEZ scheme. It also allows f...
The Convener Con
No committee member has indicated that they wish to speak. Does the cabinet secretary want to wind up? I think that you have said enough.
Michael Matheson SNP
Yes. Amendment 59 agreed to. Section 15, as amended, agreed to. Section 16 agreed to. After section 16 08:15
The Convener Con
The next group is on low-emission zones: regulations on traffic signs. Amendment 204, in the name of Jamie Greene, is the only amendment in the group.
Jamie Greene (West Scotland) (Con) Con
Good morning, cabinet secretary. Amendment 204 is about signage around low-emission zones. To my knowledge, there is currently no provision in the bill on t...
Michael Matheson SNP
Although I agree with Jamie Greene that LEZ signs will be needed to make motorists aware of the operation of those zones, amendment 204 is unnecessary. The S...
Jamie Greene Con
I thank the cabinet secretary for that very helpful update. Will he confirm that, if I do not press the amendment, we can be assured that there will be stand...
Michael Matheson SNP
As I have stated, ministers already have that power, and we intend to have consistent signage. Amendment 204, by agreement, withdrawn. Section 17 agreed to...
The Convener Con
The question is, that amendment 60 be agreed to. Are we agreed? Members: No.
The Convener Con
There will be a division. For Finnie, John (Highlands and Islands) (Green) Smyth, Colin (South Scotland) (Lab) Against Chapman, Peter (North East Scotla...
The Convener Con
The result of the division is: For 2, Against 8, Abstentions 1. Amendment 60 disagreed to. Amendment 61 moved—Michael Matheson—and agreed to. Amendment ...
The Convener Con
I remind members that if amendment 205 is agreed to, amendments 62 and 63 are pre-empted. The question is, that amendment 205 be agreed to. Are we agreed? M...
The Convener Con
There will be a division. For Chapman, Peter (North East Scotland) (Con) Greene, Jamie (West Scotland) (Con) Mountain, Edward (Highlands and Islands) (Co...
The Convener Con
The result of the division is: For 3, Against 8, Abstentions 0. Amendment 205 disagreed to. Amendment 62 moved—Michael Matheson—and agreed to. Amendment 6...
The Convener Con
The question is, that amendment 63 be agreed to. Are we agreed? Members: No.
The Convener Con
There will be a division. For Finnie, John (Highlands and Islands) (Green) Lyle, Richard (Uddingston and Bellshill) (SNP) Mason, John (Glasgow Shettlesto...
The Convener Con
The result of the division is: For 8, Against 3, Abstentions 0. Amendment 63 agreed to. Amendment 206 moved—John Finnie.
The Convener Con
The question is, that amendment 206 be agreed to. Are we agreed? Members: No.
The Convener Con
There will be a division. For Finnie, John (Highlands and Islands) (Green) Smyth, Colin (South Scotland) (Lab) Against Chapman, Peter (North East Scotla...
The Convener Con
The result of the division is: For 2, Against 9, Abstentions 0. Amendment 206 disagreed to. Section 18, as amended, agreed to. Section 19—Ministers’ gra...
The Convener Con
The next group is on low-emission zones: financial reporting and review provisions. Amendment 207, in the name of Jamie Greene, is grouped with amendments 20...
Jamie Greene Con
Amendment 207 relates to the grant-making powers of ministers. Currently, ministers may make grants to help local authorities operate a scheme. The amendment...
The Convener Con
At this point, I would have called Brian Whittle to speak to amendment 227, but he seems to have been delayed. I will try to bring him in during the debate, ...
Michael Matheson SNP
Ministers have consistently stated that the Government would provide significant funding for transport-based air pollution and LEZs. In that regard, it is ri...
The Convener Con
Brian Whittle has now turned up, but I will call him at the end.
John Finnie (Highlands and Islands) (Green) Green
I am not a fan of reports for reports’ sake, so my proposal may seem strange. That said, if we are really going to tackle the climate emergency, we need the ...
Colin Smyth (South Scotland) (Lab) Lab
Amendment 65, in my name, clarifies that local authorities should be carrying out reviews of their LEZs without ministerial direction. As it stands, local au...
The Convener Con
I call Brian Whittle to speak to amendment 227 and other amendments in the group.