Holyrood, made browsable

Hansard

Every contribution to the Official Report — chamber and committee — searchable in one place. Pulled from data.parliament.scot, indexed for full-text search, linked through to every MSP.

129
Current MSPs
415
MSPs ever elected
13
Parties on record
2,355,091
Hansard contributions
1999–2026
Coverage span
Official Report

Search Hansard contributions

Clear
Showing 0 of 2,355,091 contributions in session S6, 16 Apr 2026 – 16 May 2026. Latest 30 days: 148. Coverage: 12 May 1999 — 14 May 2026.

No contributions match those filters.

← Back to list
Chamber

Meeting of the Parliament 01 May 2019

01 May 2019 · S5 · Meeting of the Parliament
Item of business
Subject Choice
Smith, Liz Con Mid Scotland and Fife Watch on SPTV

Sorry, no—I have taken quite a lot of interventions.

There is a significant issue for the traditional value and ethos of the Scottish curriculum—namely, having a strong balance between science, social sciences and languages and maintaining real breadth at higher. If the cabinet secretary needs more evidence of that, perhaps he could look at what has happened to the uptake of modern languages and the issues with science, technology, engineering and mathematics subjects, because those are issues that many of the people who give evidence to the Parliament complain about.

Of course, that also tells us that there is a huge imbalance between the broad general education—the name tells us something—and the senior phase. I think that it was Jenny Gilruth who, rightly, argued last week that young people have more subjects to study in the early years of secondary education, because of the three and three model, as opposed to the two, two, two model. I agree, but the huge problem is that in S4 they suddenly find that they have to drop down to six subjects, which, incidentally, has a knock-on effect on the timing of their subject choice decision.

What we are saying to the cabinet secretary is that effective choice, which has always underpinned the so-called gold standard of highers and advanced highers, is now being constrained. Clear evidence points to that, which should be a major concern for this Parliament.

There are three specific things that we have to deal with. The first is the strong suggestion made by Dr Alan Britton that there is confusion about the curriculum for excellence and that it remains unclear who takes ownership of the curriculum in Scotland. That ties in with the often-made point that broad general education is designed by Education Scotland and the senior phase is designed by the Scottish Qualifications Authority. There is a disconnect somewhere along the line, and we are all agreed that we must do something about that.

Secondly, there must be a debate about what the core curriculum should offer in schools. If we look at what schools abroad are asked to do, we see that there is a desire to ensure a strong balance between knowledge-based learning and skills development, with the former seen as extremely important so that young people can make a fully informed choice.

The third thing is teacher numbers, because it is clear that the number of teachers has been squeezed, which is having a detrimental effect on the number of subjects. The availability of teachers for certain subjects is not as good as it should be.

Education is many things. It is the foundation on which we base our hopes and ambitions for our children, as well as something that touches our deepest emotions. It is the prerequisite for economic wealth, the guardian of our culture, the vehicle by which we learn about our rights and responsibilities and the key with which we unlock many doors to the wider world. It is also supposed to be the SNP’s top priority. How often have we heard in speeches or programmes for government that excellence and equity are the two principles that underpin Scottish education? How we wish that, in practice, they were.

Education is the most precious gift that we give to our young people but, for far too many of them, the current system of schooling in SNP Scotland is letting them down. The Scottish Conservatives believe that things could and should be so much better, so that Scotland can, once again, lead the world.

I move,

That the Parliament believes that Scottish education should be based on the principles of excellence and equity and that all young people, whatever their background, should be afforded the best possible educational experience at all levels of the curriculum; further believes that, while these principles are enshrined in the policy aims of the curriculum for excellence, the delivery of the new curriculum structure has exposed some fundamental failings with regard to subject choice, including the inequity that exists between schools in more affluent areas and those in more deprived communities, and calls on the Scottish Government to recognise the serious concerns, which have been expressed by teachers, parents, young people and academics, and take urgent action to address these failings in the delivery of the curriculum for excellence.

14:57  

In the same item of business

The Deputy Presiding Officer (Linda Fabiani) SNP
The next item of business is a debate on motion S5M-17091, in the name of Liz Smith, on subject choice. 14:43
Liz Smith (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Con) Con
I open the debate by reiterating our belief on the Conservative benches that Scottish education should be based on excellence and equity and that it can once...
The Deputy First Minister and Cabinet Secretary for Education and Skills (John Swinney) SNP
Does Liz Smith not understand the inherent contradiction in that last remark? At the same time as welcoming the fact that other curriculum choices and offeri...
Liz Smith Con
There is no contradiction whatever in what I said because, as the Education and Skills Committee was reminded this morning, the critical issue is not about t...
John Mason (Glasgow Shettleston) (SNP) SNP
I am slightly puzzled. Liz Smith seems to be arguing, on the one hand, for more consistency at a national level and, on the other, for more autonomy for indi...
Liz Smith Con
Yes. The fundamental principles of the curriculum for excellence have not allowed the two to match up. Of course, we need consistency and core curricular sub...
John Swinney SNP
I do not understand a fundamental point about the Conservatives’ position. I agree with the Conservatives that schools should have much more discretion over ...
The Deputy Presiding Officer SNP
I can allow you a little extra time, Ms Smith.
Liz Smith Con
I will give the cabinet secretary the example that Terry Lanagan of the Association of Directors of Education in Scotland gave us. Tavish Scott asked if it w...
John Swinney SNP
Will the member take an intervention?
Liz Smith Con
Sorry, no—I have taken quite a lot of interventions. There is a significant issue for the traditional value and ethos of the Scottish curriculum—namely, hav...
The Deputy First Minister and Cabinet Secretary for Education and Skills (John Swinney) SNP
The purpose of curriculum for excellence is to provide young people with the skills, knowledge and experiences that will prepare them for life beyond school ...
Liz Smith Con
It is not all about numbers, but about the nature of the choices that young people are afforded. That is the key point.
John Swinney SNP
To be technically correct, there is a relationship between the numbers and the choices—of course there must be. I am about to come on to the question of the ...
Oliver Mundell (Dumfriesshire) (Con) Con
I understand the point that the cabinet secretary is trying to make, but does he recognise that if pupils drop subjects in S4—particularly modern languages a...
John Swinney SNP
I do not accept that that is pupils’ experience. Mr Mundell’s question suggests that when a young person leaves the broad general education phase they dispen...
John Swinney SNP
If Liz Smith will forgive me, I will not take her intervention, because I still have a lot of ground to cover. Focusing on the numbers of qualifications tha...
Oliver Mundell Con
Will the cabinet secretary take an intervention?
John Swinney SNP
If Mr Mundell will forgive me, I will not. I still have some detail to cover. Work-based provision for young people in the senior phase is growing. The prop...
Johann Lamont (Glasgow) (Lab) Lab
Will the cabinet secretary confirm that he will do an analysis of what those positive destinations are? Far too often, they consist of insecure work, zero-ho...
John Swinney SNP
I will be very happy to explore the substance behind the figures, but we should recognise the fact that young people are leaving school with more qualificati...
Oliver Mundell Con
You have dismissed it out of hand.
John Swinney SNP
No. It has been disputed by academics other than those from whom the committee has heard. It has been disputed not just by me, but by other academics. The c...
Ross Greer (West Scotland) (Green) Green
Will the cabinet secretary take an intervention on that point?
John Swinney SNP
I will.
The Deputy Presiding Officer (Christine Grahame) SNP
It will have to be brief. You have got only about a minute more, cabinet secretary.
Ross Greer Green
I will be very brief. Does the cabinet secretary accept that if we spent more time debating education in Government time, the issue, which has been in the pu...
John Swinney SNP
What I cannot understand is why, given that we have an Education and Skills Committee process under way that is supposed take in excess of 20 hours to consid...
The Deputy Presiding Officer SNP
Cabinet secretary—Interruption. I am losing my voice.
John Swinney SNP
I move amendment S5M-17091.4, to leave out from “the delivery of the new curriculum” to end and insert: “it is necessary to be assured that this is the case...