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Chamber

Meeting of the Parliament 21 March 2019

21 Mar 2019 · S5 · Meeting of the Parliament
Item of business
Land Reform
Carson, Finlay Con Galloway and West Dumfries Watch on SPTV

Not at all. There are some issues, but the report should have been balanced and should have recognised that there are some benefits to be gained from large-scale ownership.

We should look at the big picture and consider whether the impacts of large-scale and concentrated land ownership are significant compared with the impacts of local planning policy or, more important, Government policy in relation to forestry targets, peat restoration targets, renewable energy targets or, indeed, agricultural production targets.

There has not been a cry from the public for further land reform. Because the agenda has been driven by the Scottish Government, there is a risk that that could herald a one-sided debate when it comes to future land reform and land ownership. Quite wrongly, the idea has been planted that concentrated land ownership puts fragile communities at risk. There have been some fantastic examples of landowners and communities working closely together in my constituency. As well as the work of the Mull of Galloway Trust, there is the example of Kirkcudbright Community Trust’s takeover of Barrhill woods

When I was a councillor on Dumfries and Galloway Council, I was delighted to see the benefits of concentrated land ownership in the village of Dalton. On the Dormont estate, eight new homes were created that met low-energy standards that were well above the UK standards. Much credit should be given to Jamie Carruthers for the two and three-bedroomed houses that he built in response to his concerns about the lack of rural housing. He is not a large landowner, but he was determined to fix a problem with housing in rural Dumfries and Galloway. After carrying out surveys and fighting a long battle with local planners and road authorities, he eventually managed to get the houses built with the support of a Scottish Government grant.

Those award-winning houses benefit the community by, for example, keeping children in the village school. The question is whether Jamie Carruthers would have passed the fairness test that is supported by the Scottish Land Commission and the Scottish Government. Would they have seen it as wrong that the estate owner owned all the land and all the houses? I fear that Jamie Carruthers might well have failed that test. When, as housing minister, Kevin Stewart visited the Dormont estate in 2017, he welcomed the creation of more rural housing and recognised the role of the Passivhaus approach in helping to remove the threat of fuel poverty. Can we not celebrate the fact that such concentrated ownership works, instead of moving the goalposts at every opportunity when it comes to land reform?

Another issue to do with land reform that I would like to mention is people’s rights and responsibilities with regard to accessing land and the freedom to roam. I have been dealing with a constituent who lives in the village of Ringford, where a core path has been installed at his address. He believes that that is in direct contravention of the Land Reform (Scotland) Act 2003, as well as the 2005 Scottish outdoor access code. He has raised a number of concerns to do with privacy, as the core path gives a clear view into his home, which presents a security risk. He is also unable to allow his pets to roam. Furthermore, there are issues with horses using the path and causing damage to the driveway that he owns. If the core path were to be established now, it would be considered to be unlawfully sited. Will the cabinet secretary commit to ensuring that local authorities follow the right guidelines on the siting of core paths and that, when it comes to land use, owners’ rights and responsibilities are correctly respected?

Today’s debate comes at a hugely important juncture in the process of land reform across Scotland. I believe that, in its approach, the Scottish Government does not recognise the good work that is being done in our rural communities by landowners and communities working together and following good land management practice. Where landowners are working with communities and making a substantial difference on a daily basis, we must ensure that any reforms truly benefit our rural communities.

16:03  

In the same item of business

The Deputy Presiding Officer (Linda Fabiani) SNP
I ask members to shift their seats quickly. The next item is a debate on motion S5M-16445, in the name of Roseanna Cunningham, on land reform in Scotland. 1...
The Cabinet Secretary for Environment, Climate Change and Land Reform (Roseanna Cunningham) SNP
Land reform is a subject that has been relevant to Scotland for several hundred years, and I have to say that it sometimes seems as though I have been talkin...
Rhoda Grant (Highlands and Islands) (Lab) Lab
Land ownership is totally unbalanced in Scotland. If we move towards the purchase of smaller amounts of land, how will we change the fact that 50 per cent of...
Roseanna Cunningham SNP
If Rhoda Grant listens to the rest of my speech, she will understand the direction of travel. We also want to reflect the importance of urban community owner...
Edward Mountain (Highlands and Islands) (Con) Con
Before I start, I refer members to my entry in the register of interests, which says that I am a partner in a farming partnership. I also own land. I hope t...
Andy Wightman (Lothian) (Green) Green
Mr Mountain says that we should not obsess over who owns land, and that it is how it is used and managed that matters. Why, then, is the landed class and ind...
Edward Mountain Con
I think that the people I employ are happy that I look after and manage my business in the way that I work it, as it gives them a job and creates prosperity ...
Gillian Martin (Aberdeenshire East) (SNP) SNP
Will the member take an intervention?
Edward Mountain Con
I am going to make a bit of time. I will perhaps let the member intervene if there is an opportunity later. I want to look at some of the comments in the ...
Gillian Martin SNP
My point is not the one that I was going to make when I tried to intervene earlier. How would Edward Mountain react to another case that was mentioned in the...
Edward Mountain Con
I cannot look at an example without its being substantiated. That is the problem with the report. Ms Martin will be well aware that sometimes when people are...
Claudia Beamish (South Scotland) (Lab) Lab
It is timely that the Scottish Government has lodged the motion for debate today, because it gives us an opportunity to reflect on what has been achieved in ...
Finlay Carson (Galloway and West Dumfries) (Con) Con
Will the member take an intervention?
Claudia Beamish Lab
No—I am sorry. I have not got time. I have very few minutes. It is time for a powerful land regulator to examine whether existing ownership helps or hinders...
Andy Wightman (Lothian) (Green) Green
I am grateful to the cabinet secretary for this timely debate. As she noted, land reform is a difficult process to deal with. As the Government motion hints,...
Edward Mountain Con
I hardly think that that is my “common theme”, Presiding Officer. To quote the Land Commission’s report, it gives a “Summary of Macro Themes Identified in t...
Andy Wightman Green
I confess that I have not read the report in enough detail to come to a conclusive view on that. I suspect that that might be a selective reading of what is ...
Liam McArthur (Orkney Islands) (LD) LD
I am grateful for the opportunity to speak in this debate on land reform. It is still a source of pride for me that the Scottish Liberal Democrats put land r...
The Presiding Officer (Ken Macintosh) NPA
We move on to the open debate. 15:50
Gillian Martin (Aberdeenshire East) (SNP) SNP
Since the passing of the Land Reform (Scotland) Bill in 2003, we have had a chance to reflect on whether Scotland’s communities are thriving as a result. In ...
Edward Mountain Con
I remember reading that part of the report, which relates to a factor sitting at the front of a meeting and taking notes. One person found that intimidating....
Gillian Martin SNP
Unlike Edward Mountain, who seems to be dismissive of some people’s testimony, I have read the whole testimony—
Edward Mountain Con
It was one person.
Gillian Martin SNP
When one person comes to my constituency surgery and says that they have a problem with someone, I do not ask how many other people are affected or for proof...
Finlay Carson (Galloway and West Dumfries) (Con) Con
I am pleased to speak in this debate a week after I spoke in Andy Wightman’s members’ business debate on who owns Scotland. The subject of land reform in Sco...
Andy Wightman Green
The member expresses concern about the report’s title. Does he accept that there are issues associated with large-scale and concentrated land ownership in Sc...
Finlay Carson Con
Not at all. There are some issues, but the report should have been balanced and should have recognised that there are some benefits to be gained from large-s...
Alex Rowley (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Lab) Lab
I welcome today’s debate on land reform in Scotland and agree with the cabinet secretary that land is one of Scotland’s most important assets. It is because ...
Kenneth Gibson (Cunninghame North) (SNP) SNP
Land ownership has been contentious for centuries, but Scottish policy on land is now increasingly rooted in questions of fairness, equality and human rights...
John Scott (Ayr) (Con) Con
I declare an interest as a farmer and food producer, and as a member of NFU Scotland. I welcome the debate and the publication of the Scottish Land Commissi...