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Chamber

Meeting of the Parliament 08 January 2019

08 Jan 2019 · S5 · Meeting of the Parliament
Item of business
Ultra-low-emission Vehicles

For once, my previous employment is actually of some use in a debate in Parliament. People lazily say “a former used-car salesman”. At this point, I say for the record that I never sold a used car in my life. My involvement in the industry was in corporate-fleet sales. When I was involved in that industry 11 years ago, 80 per cent of the new-car market was fleet and corporate vehicles, with only 20 per cent being made up of retail. That is unusual; people expect to walk in to a car showroom and buy a vehicle. The greater volume was in that 80 per cent, but not the profit, which came from poor guys like MSPs turning up at a dealership to get a car.

One of the negatives that people constantly mention about electric vehicles is how much they cost. As someone who has worked in the industry, my argument is that the manufacturers are beholden—they have the opportunity to discount vehicles such that they can obtain market share and ensure that they get models. They have done that in the past, and the responsibility to do so is theirs now.

As has already been mentioned, another problem is battery power. The most popular car in the UK electric vehicle market is the Nissan Leaf, which is said to have a 250-mile range. However, we all know that, in reality, that is not necessarily so, because the range that is achieved depends on the driver’s driving style, the road that they are on, the weather that they are going through and how much power they have. I would probably struggle to get a vehicle from Paisley to Edinburgh and back on one charge, which would be a problem from the start. I can only imagine how that would affect someone who lives in a rural environment.

The battery issue is a technological one that we might be able to solve as the technology gets better. However, as John Finnie rightly said, the components that make up batteries are also a problem. If we are seeking a sustainable future, those who control the batteries and where they go will control the market. Manufacturers have worked that out.

Elon Musk is having a problem. It is difficult to start a company and go from zero to whatever overnight, as he has done with Tesla cars. However, he has not delivered on any of the targets that he, as a manufacturer, has set. He probably has more chance of reaching Mars with his other project than he has of reaching some of the car vehicle targets that he has made. In all honesty, that is what the motoring press would tell us.

Yesterday, I read that Norway is the biggest market for Tesla in Europe, but that the Netherlands nearly beat it—it was just a hundred cars short—because companies there, including major car rental companies, bought 8,585 vehicles. As I have said, I have dealt with the corporate-fleet world, so I think that what will make the difference is getting it and industry to think that way and to see electric vehicles as the way forward.

The Scottish Government cannot achieve that on its own: it will have to work in collaboration with the transport industry—particularly, bus and haulage companies. I spoke to Craig Allan, who runs Paisley Taxis Ltd, which is one of the traditional Hackney cab companies. He bought one of the new electric London cabs, whose manufacturer is not called the London Taxi Company any more. It traditionally made the old Hackney cab, but it has moved on and is now called the London Electric Vehicle Company. It has seen the change. For the major part of the market that it supplies, legislation has changed so dramatically that it has had to change how it does business. That is a perfect example of how legislation can make a difference in the future and how we in Parliament could dictate to industry and manufacturers in order to change their ways.

The new LEVC TX is manufactured at a new facility at Ansty Park, near Coventry. It was purpose built with a £325 million investment—the biggest investment in a UK car plant in the past 10 or 15 years. That shows us that if we, as legislators, can make changes, however small and in whatever way, we can achieve things.

I got in touch with some car companies. It is ironic that the ones that I used to work for did not get back to me. I do not know what that says. The Renault Nissan Mitsubishi alliance’s response was interesting. It talked about how it is a market leader and has sold 490,000 EVs worldwide, and said:

“In addition to this, as a leader in charging infrastructure, Nissan has more than 2,300 quick-charge stations in Europe. This number is predicted to increase to 5,500 by 2020.”

That shows that car companies are moving the right way, too. Therefore, we must, as legislators, ensure that we work with them to achieve what we want.

I do not see the problems that other members have mentioned: we can get this right. I would almost guarantee that, come the next time members are buying their cars, the vast majority of us will buy electric vehicles.

15:24  

In the same item of business

The Presiding Officer (Ken Macintosh) NPA
The next item of business is a debate on motion S5M-15243, in the name of Michael Matheson, on ultra-low-emission vehicles. 14:30
The Cabinet Secretary for Transport, Infrastructure and Connectivity (Michael Matheson) SNP
In 2017, we announced our commitment to phase out the need for petrol and diesel cars and vans by 2032. Since then, we have seen huge shifts in the electric ...
Murdo Fraser (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Con) Con
As the owner and daily user of a hybrid vehicle, I applaud the Scottish Government for its—if I can use this pun—direction of travel. However, I am also the ...
Michael Matheson SNP
There is no plan to ban petrol or diesel vehicles, but Murdo Fraser might have difficulty in getting his classic car into low-emission zones in our big citie...
John Mason (Glasgow Shettleston) (SNP) SNP
The cabinet secretary has mentioned electricity a few times. Is there a place for hydrogen in the mix?
Michael Matheson SNP
If John Mason bears with me, I will get to hydrogen, which has an important role to play. This year, we will expand the scope and ambition of our work so th...
Daniel Johnson (Edinburgh Southern) (Lab) Lab
Is there a risk in overfocusing on types of power, whether it is hydrogen or electric, to the exclusion of automation? The combination of automation with ele...
Michael Matheson SNP
Daniel Johnson raises an important point. Such issues need to be considered, but the timeline for progress on them is different. That is why we need to take ...
Jamie Greene (West Scotland) (Con) Con
There is no better way to kick-start the new year than to discuss an issue that will affect not only this generation but the generations to come: climate cha...
Gillian Martin (Aberdeenshire East) (SNP) SNP
Does the member agree that is it incumbent on us, as society’s highest earners and its representatives, to lead the way with our choice of vehicles and to go...
Jamie Greene Con
Absolutely. However, given the number of miles and the distances that we cover, as many other people do in their daily lives, the problem is that there are s...
Colin Smyth (South Scotland) (Lab) Lab
Transport accounts for almost two thirds of Scotland’s greenhouse gas emissions, with road transport responsible for almost three quarters of that. If we are...
John Finnie (Highlands and Islands) (Green) Green
I commend what the Government motion says about “an unprecedented period”. It most certainly is unprecedented, but I suspect that we are talking about slight...
Liam McArthur (Orkney Islands) (LD) LD
I thank the transport secretary for lodging his motion, which allows us to start 2019 with this important debate. In the context of the recent lack of progre...
The Presiding Officer NPA
We turn to the open debate. Members have five minutes for their contributions. 15:10
Gillian Martin (Aberdeenshire East) (SNP) SNP
Happy new year, Presiding Officer. Scotland has some of the world’s most ambitious targets when it comes to making our country a low-carbon economy. It goes...
Edward Mountain (Highlands and Islands) (Con) Con
I refer members to my entry in the register of members’ interests, specifically on farming. The way that the world travels is changing: the wheel has not be...
George Adam (Paisley) (SNP) SNP
For once, my previous employment is actually of some use in a debate in Parliament. People lazily say “a former used-car salesman”. At this point, I say for ...
Claudia Beamish (South Scotland) (Lab) Lab
As we have heard, ultra-low-emission vehicles are an important part of a reimagined and progressive transport system for Scotland’s future. Many of us consid...
The Presiding Officer NPA
Very briefly, please.
Claudia Beamish Lab
Rural poverty can be hidden in small pockets, but many people in rural areas face real difficulties. I believe that there is a case to be made for providing ...
The Presiding Officer NPA
That was brief—thank you. 15:30
John Scott (Ayr) (Con) Con
I begin by declaring an interest as a farmer, an historical rural dweller and the owner of a rural business. I welcome this debate on ultra-low-emission vehi...
The Deputy Presiding Officer (Christine Grahame) SNP
I must tell members that we are very tight for time, because a statement has to follow the debate at 4.30. 15:34
Stewart Stevenson (Banffshire and Buchan Coast) (SNP) SNP
I declare that I am honorary president of the Scottish Association for Public Transport and honorary vice-president of Railfuture. I listened with interest ...
Jamie Greene Con
Will the member give way?
Stewart Stevenson SNP
I suspect that I do not have time; I ask the member to forgive me. Claudia Beamish talked about planning and domestic houses. My colleague Richard Lyle has ...
Lewis Macdonald (North East Scotland) (Lab) Lab
It is scarcely 100 years since transport in the western world was revolutionised by the rise of the internal combustion engine, which decisively replaced hor...
The Deputy Presiding Officer SNP
You must conclude there. I am sorry, but I must be very firm. I want to fit in everyone who has been sitting waiting. 15:45
Angus MacDonald (Falkirk East) (SNP) SNP
Scotland, as a nation, is changing in many ways. Change, in most circumstances, is welcome—and the change that we are seeing in the advancement of our infras...