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Chamber

Meeting of the Parliament 18 December 2018

18 Dec 2018 · S5 · Meeting of the Parliament
Item of business
Damages (Investment Returns and Periodical Repayments) (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1
Johnson, Daniel Lab Edinburgh Southern Watch on SPTV

I, too, thank the clerks and members of the Economy, Energy and Fair Work Committee for their excellent work at stage 1 of the Damages (Investment Returns and Periodical Payments) (Scotland) Bill. I acknowledge the many organisations and individuals who participated in the consultation process.

Scottish Labour welcomes the introduction of the bill. The bill seeks to calculate personal awards of damages through the injury discount rate in a way that is

“clear, certain, fair, regular, transparent and credible”.

Ultimately, the bill is about providing security to those who have been injured through the actions of others, often leaving them with life-altering conditions and with substantial life decisions to make.

As members have noted, although this is a technical bill, at its heart is something fundamental and understandable. It is about protecting vulnerable people and making sure that we have in place a system that is fair and equitable, so that they can make the decisions that they need to make in very difficult circumstances. Importantly, it is also about finding the right balance so that our public bodies, in particular the NHS, do not incur unreasonable costs and liabilities. There is also the important point that undercompensating can lead to many such bodies having large bills. If we undercompensate—if we give people too little—often it is the NHS that ultimately picks up the bill.

Although Labour agrees with the broad principles that are outlined in the stage 1 report, we recognise that there are parts of the proposed legislation that need to be tested robustly as the bill proceeds through stages 2 and 3. I will outline two or three such areas in my speech. The first area that requires scrutiny is the make-up of the notional portfolio, which we have already heard about. Concerns have been raised that it is too cautious and too focused on fixed assets at the expense of equities, even though equities would deliver a higher rate of return.

However, we need to strike a cautious note, in particular around the notion of the hypothetical investor. Although it is reasonable to assume that vulnerable people will invest, it is not reasonable to assume that they will become investment experts, or that they should assume risk or that they require to be speculators. It is not reasonable that they have to put their damages award under a metaphorical mattress, but nor should we expect them to bet on the stock market and to base their future on such speculation.

The notional portfolio would need be updated regularly to keep up with market changes, but it is unclear whether the Scottish Government or the UK Government Actuary’s Department would be responsible for doing that. Likewise, it is unclear whether the series of adjustments that are set out in the bill would be adequate to cover the cost of inflation, tax and investment advice or underperformance. We must test all those aspects as the bill proceeds.

Periodical payment orders would allow courts to make awards for future economic loss and for payments to be made in a periodic manner, thereby increasing the security of such payments. We welcome that provision, which can mitigate against some of the uncertainty that is associated with lump sums. For vulnerable individuals in particular, it can provide welcome certainty. However, more weight should be given to a pursuer’s views when a court is asked to decide on a PPO and members have already raised that point. Ultimately, the bill should seek to empower those who seek compensation, instead of taking away any more of their control.

On the 30-year period, despite evidence that suggests that the average life expectancy following a serious personal injury claim with damages of more than £250,000 is 46 years, the bill creates an assumption that the hypothetical investor will hold their assets for a 30-year period. In her evidence, the minister stated:

“There is no authority on which to base that figure; it was chosen merely as a useful duration that was neither too short nor too long.”—[Official Report, Economy, Energy and Fair Work Committee, 6 November 2018; c 8.]

It is important that the period is examined and carefully considered so that the bill provides for a payment period that is realistic.

Labour welcomes the bill and supports its aim of creating a

“fair, ... transparent and credible”

personal injury discount rate. Although it represents progress, the bill is far from perfect and the proposed legislation must be tested robustly and scrutinised closely as it moves forward. Changes in the areas that I have mentioned will help strengthen the bill to provide greater security to those people who have been injured through wrongful action, while also protecting public bodies from unreasonable costs and liabilities. The bill will ensure that we have in place a just system that is fair and equitable. I look forward to following the bill’s progress through stages 2 and 3.

In the same item of business

The Deputy Presiding Officer (Linda Fabiani) SNP
The next item of business is a debate on motion S5M-15169, in the name of Ash Denham, on the Damages (Investment Returns and Periodical Payments) (Scotland) ...
The Minister for Community Safety (Ash Denham) SNP
I am very pleased to be here to open the debate on the general principles of the Damages (Investment Returns and Periodical Payments) (Scotland) Bill. I than...
Daniel Johnson (Edinburgh Southern) (Lab) Lab
I accept the minister’s point, in broad terms. Will she give some detail about the out-of-cycle review? In a five-year period, assumptions around investments...
Ash Denham SNP
Daniel Johnson makes a good point. The general point is that the rate must meet the needs of the hypothetical investor and ensure that they get the right amo...
John Mason (Glasgow Shettleston) (SNP) SNP
The committee had concerns about the fact that the court could impose on a pursuer who, for various reasons, might not want a continuing relationship with th...
Ash Denham SNP
We have taken account of that. We recognise that there are many reasons why a PPO might not be suitable for a pursuer or a defender, but we think that the co...
The Deputy Presiding Officer SNP
I call Gordon Lindhurst to speak on behalf of the Economy, Energy and Fair Work Committee for up to eight minutes. 15:48
Gordon Lindhurst (Lothian) (Con) Con
I trust that all members present have read our stage 1 report, which is a classic of the genre. Neil Findlay is not present on this occasion to ask me a ques...
Dean Lockhart (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Con) Con
I thank those who provided submissions on the bill and the witnesses who attended the three Economy, Energy and Fair Work Committee sessions that were dedica...
Daniel Johnson Lab
I thank the member for giving way. I accept some of what he is saying, but does he not accept that the language being used—the talk of a portfolio of balance...
Dean Lockhart Con
The member makes a fair point. That is why the further adjustments that we will come to—such as the 0.5 per cent deduction to pay for professional advice in ...
John Mason SNP
Will the member accept that it is inevitable that some people will be undercompensated and some will be overcompensated? It is not possible to exactly compen...
Dean Lockhart Con
That is a fair point to make, although the vast majority of the evidence sided with the probability that overcompensation would be the likely result of these...
Stewart Stevenson (Banffshire and Buchan Coast) (SNP) SNP
Will the member give way?
Dean Lockhart Con
I am literally about to wrap up. The Damages (Investment Returns and Periodical Payments) (Scotland) Bill is technical, but it is vitally important for thos...
Daniel Johnson (Edinburgh Southern) (Lab) Lab
I, too, thank the clerks and members of the Economy, Energy and Fair Work Committee for their excellent work at stage 1 of the Damages (Investment Returns an...
The Deputy Presiding Officer (Christine Grahame) SNP
We move to the open part of the debate. Members have a generous four minutes for speeches. 16:09
John Mason (Glasgow Shettleston) (SNP) SNP
The bill has been more interesting than I think that some committee members might have anticipated. The bill may affect a relatively small number of people, ...
Maurice Corry (West Scotland) (Con) Con
I, along with my colleagues, welcome this stage 1 debate on the bill. Suffering personal injury is never expected. No one ever wants to have to claim compens...
Angela Constance (Almond Valley) (SNP) SNP
Although the number of people who are directly affected by the bill is small, the bill is nonetheless crucial. We should always remember whose interests are ...
Jackie Baillie (Dumbarton) (Lab) Lab
As a member of the Economy, Energy and Fair Work Committee, which scrutinised the bill, I am grateful to have the opportunity to speak in the debate. Four mi...
The Deputy Presiding Officer SNP
I can give you five minutes.
Jackie Baillie Lab
Oh, my goodness! I cannot guarantee that my arguments will be any more elegant. Let me cut to the chase and focus on two areas: the discount rate and periodi...
Stewart Stevenson (Banffshire and Buchan Coast) (SNP) SNP
I have not been involved with the bill thus far, but I want to develop a number of its aspects; Jackie Baillie has touched on them already. The committee’s ...
John Mason SNP
Will the member give way?
Stewart Stevenson SNP
I will give way to somebody who knows more than I do about that matter.
John Mason SNP
The committee received evidence—I do not know whether the member would agree with it—that perhaps the investment cost would be higher at the beginning and lo...
Stewart Stevenson SNP
I am absolutely sure that the member is correct, but that goes to the heart of how the compensation is provided: whether it is paid in a lump sum up front or...
Jackie Baillie Lab
I will helpfully supply Stewart Stevenson with the discount rate that he was looking for. The Association of Personal Injury Lawyers supplied us with it: it ...
Stewart Stevenson SNP
That is broadly what I would have expected, so I am obliged to the member for that. Investors come in all shapes and forms. Over the years, with my wife, I ...