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Chamber

Meeting of the Parliament 05 October 2017

05 Oct 2017 · S5 · Meeting of the Parliament
Item of business
Wild Animals in Travelling Circuses (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

I declare an interest as an honorary member of the British Veterinary Association.

The Scottish Conservative Party and I welcome the bill’s general principles. I know that the British Veterinary Association, OneKind and others have campaigned for a ban on the use of wild animals in travelling circuses for many years, as they and we believe that the needs of non-domesticated wild animals—in particular, their accommodation needs and their need to express normal behaviour—cannot be met in a travelling circus.

For the time being, Scotland’s legislative benchmark is the Animal Health and Welfare (Scotland) Act 2006 and the five welfare needs of animals that it details. In this stage 1 debate, we seek to build on that position. That said, we note the 2007 review by the Department for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs, which found that there was a lack of evidence to support a science-based ban on the use of wild animals in travelling circuses. On the other hand, we note the scientific review that was carried out for the Welsh Government post-2007, which concluded that

“captive wild animals in circuses and other travelling animal shows do not achieve their optimal welfare requirements”.

Although it is surprising that we in Scotland are relying on work that has been carried out elsewhere in the United Kingdom to support the bill, that is probably because no wild animals in travelling circuses are visiting Scotland at the moment and none is likely to do so in the foreseeable future.

The ethical case for the bill has, at best, been poorly made by the Scottish Government, notwithstanding Emma Harper’s valiant attempts to make it. It is much easier to make the case for such a ban on animal welfare grounds, and the Government’s response to paragraph 130 of the stage 1 report tacitly acknowledges that it would be much more sensible to take forward the bill on welfare grounds.

We must seek to improve the bill to make it fit for purpose, which it currently is not. As others have said, the term “travelling circus” must be properly defined, and I welcome the Government’s intention to provide a guidance note for the bill that will

“include guidance and examples around the definition of circus.”

I also welcome the Government’s willingness to consider appropriate amendments of the definition, although I might leave that possibility to finer legal minds than mine, given the parameters that the Government has set for its acceptance of such amendments.

In addition, a list of wild animals should be provided in the bill. It need not be exhaustive, but it should be indicative and it should be able to be added to or subtracted from by statutory instrument, as appropriate, over time. I note and welcome the Government’s response to that suggestion, but I nonetheless urge it to lodge an appropriate stage 2 amendment to create a list of wild animals.

When there is an opportunity for principles, policy and definition to be expressed clearly in any bill—not just this one—the opportunity should be taken and as little as possible should be left to subordinate legislation. My recollection is that the cabinet secretary adheres to that view.

Local authorities need clear guidance on the enforcement duties that will be expected of them under the bill, so I welcome the Government’s response to paragraphs 315 and 320 of the report. In particular—unlike my colleague Angus MacDonald—I welcome the level of discretion that it is intended will be given to local authorities and I welcome the intention not to overburden local authorities with potential extra expenses.

We support the general principles of the bill, but there is still much work to do to make it fit for purpose. The Scottish Conservative and Unionist Party will, of course, work constructively with the Scottish Government and others towards that goal.

16:05  

In the same item of business

The Deputy Presiding Officer (Christine Grahame) SNP
The next item of business is a debate on motion S5M-08062, in the name of Roseanna Cunningham, on stage 1 of the Wild Animals in Travelling Circuses (Scotlan...
The Cabinet Secretary for Environment, Climate Change and Land Reform (Roseanna Cunningham) SNP
I first thank the Environment, Climate Change and Land Reform Committee for its consideration of the bill. The committee took a great deal of evidence from a...
The Deputy Presiding Officer SNP
Thank you, cabinet secretary. I call Graeme Dey, convener of the Environment, Climate Change and Land Reform Committee, to speak on behalf of the committee. ...
Graeme Dey (Angus South) (SNP) SNP
I am delighted to speak in the debate on behalf of the committee. I thank the members of the committee for their efforts in producing the unanimous report on...
The Deputy Presiding Officer SNP
Yes. We have a little time in hand.
Graeme Dey SNP
On the day on which the bill was introduced, the cabinet secretary wrote to the committee to highlight the intention to review the operation of the Performin...
Roseanna Cunningham SNP
Will the member give way?
The Deputy Presiding Officer SNP
I am sorry, cabinet secretary—the member must wind up now. Interruption. That is a fearsome look you are giving me, cabinet secretary, but I think that we re...
Roseanna Cunningham SNP
I would just like to ask my colleague whether he would seriously have preferred to have delayed all this for a number of years, because that would be the con...
The Deputy Presiding Officer SNP
Briefly, convener.
Graeme Dey SNP
As the cabinet secretary knows, I am reflecting the views of the whole committee, not just my own. I take her point on board, but that view was reached unani...
Donald Cameron (Highlands and Islands) (Con) Con
I commend the committee’s report and the convener’s comments, which we have just heard. The Scottish Conservatives will support the Government’s motion, and ...
The Deputy Presiding Officer SNP
Thank you very much, Mr Cameron. I hope that we have run out of animal references, but we probably have not. I call David Stewart to open on behalf of Labour...
David Stewart (Highlands and Islands) (Lab) Lab
Thank you, Presiding Officer. I rise to speak in support of the general principles of the bill. However, a number of recommendations that have been proposed ...
The Deputy Presiding Officer SNP
We come to the open debate, and I ask for speeches of four minutes. One member who is due to speak has forgotten to press their request-to-speak button—I wil...
Emma Harper (South Scotland) (SNP) SNP
I am a member of the Environment, Climate Change and Land Reform Committee, which is responsible for scrutinising the bill, and I thank the members, the cler...
The Deputy Presiding Officer SNP
I am afraid that you must conclude now.
Emma Harper SNP
I will conclude, Presiding Officer. Nineteen countries have already banned it, so it is time for Scotland to lead the way for the rest of the UK.
The Deputy Presiding Officer SNP
Sometimes I do not win. Laughter. 15:37
Peter Chapman (North East Scotland) (Con) Con
The debate is about wild animals, so for once I do not need to declare an interest. Laughter. To be honest, when I am in a pen with a newly calved coo, I som...
Clare Adamson (Motherwell and Wishaw) (SNP) SNP
As an elected parliamentarian and councillor, I have been pleased to make links over the years with the Scottish Showmen’s Guild. On a number of occasions, I...
Colin Smyth (South Scotland) (Lab) Lab
Presiding Officer, as your deputy on the cross-party group on animal welfare, it is a privilege to speak in a debate that I hope will take Scotland a step fo...
Mark Ruskell (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Green) Green
As a member of the Environment, Climate Change and Land Reform Committee, I join the convener in thanking all the stakeholders who gave evidence and the cler...
Liam McArthur (Orkney Islands) (LD) LD
I thank Graeme Dey and his colleagues on the Environment, Climate Change and Land Reform Committee for the work that they have done. I recognise the overwhe...
Angus MacDonald (Falkirk East) (SNP) SNP
As a member of the ECCLR Committee, I am pleased to contribute to the debate, not least because it is a further step towards Scotland leading the way for the...
John Scott (Ayr) (Con) Con
I declare an interest as an honorary member of the British Veterinary Association. The Scottish Conservative Party and I welcome the bill’s general principl...
Kate Forbes (Skye, Lochaber and Badenoch) (SNP) SNP
It is great to have this debate in the chamber after lengthy discussions in committee. We spent a number of hours taking evidence on and discussing the bill—...
Claudia Beamish (South Scotland) (Lab) Lab
Yesterday was world animal welfare day. As we have heard this afternoon, we should all work together to sharpen the bill and to develop further protections f...
The Deputy Presiding Officer SNP
I call Finlay Carson. You can have a generous six minutes, Mr Carson—but not too generous. 16:13
Finlay Carson (Galloway and West Dumfries) (Con) Con
Today’s debate has been constructive with many valid and important points made about the bill. The committee convener addressed concerns over definitions, wh...