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Chamber

Meeting of the Parliament 03 October 2017

03 Oct 2017 · S5 · Meeting of the Parliament
Item of business
Universal Credit (Roll-out)
Rowley, Alex Lab Mid Scotland and Fife Watch on SPTV

When the Parliament last debated universal credit, a few weeks ago, I said that I would welcome a Government debate on the issue, so I am glad to be speaking in this debate to move Labour’s amendment and support the Government motion.

Where we can work together as a Parliament, we should do so. I am glad that the majority of parties in the Parliament are working together in their efforts to stop the roll-out of universal credit, which is having such a negative impact on the health and wellbeing of so many people in Scotland.

I acknowledge Citizens Advice Scotland’s work to highlight the major flaws and to build the campaign to stop the roll-out. The campaign is supported by 24 Scottish charities, including Shelter Scotland, Oxfam Scotland, Children in Scotland, the Poverty Alliance, the Coalition of Carers in Scotland, Enable Scotland and the Scottish Federation of Housing Associations. Given that we can add to that list the churches, the trade unions and the many other organisations that are getting in touch with members of the Scottish Parliament, it is fair to say that Scottish civic society—indeed, the majority of Scotland—is calling on the Westminster Government to stop the roll-out of universal credit and sort out the problems.

The debate is timely, because we have seen updates on the issue from the Tory party conference this week and increased coverage in the news as the full extent of the problems becomes even more evident—evident to all, it seems, apart from the Tories. The work and pensions secretary intervened this week to announce that people who are claiming universal credit and are struggling to pay their bills will now be able to get a cash advance up front on the day that they claim. However, that is not a solution to the problems inherent in the structural set-up of universal credit; it is a sticking-plaster solution that tries to hide the problems that have been occurring across the roll-out areas up and down our country. Across the pilot areas, we have seen a large rise in rent arrears, an almost doubling of crisis grants and massive increases in the need to depend on charity for that most basic necessity: the ability to feed ourselves and our families. How on earth can that be ignored? It cannot.

By making that latest commitment, the work and pensions secretary clearly recognises that there is a problem with the six-week period for payment. Yet, instead of calling a halt to the accelerated roll-out, he is committed to carrying on regardless. He is ignoring calls from civic organisations across the country, Opposition politicians and even a number of Tory MPs who have added their names to the list of those who are calling for a halt to the roll-out.

When we debated the issue last, I asked:

“Why would any Government in a civilised society continue to roll out a new policy that it knows is going to hurt tens of thousands of people, will drive people into debt and towards relying on charity to feed themselves, and will result in even more people in our country being driven into poverty?”—[Official Report, 7 September 2017; c 28.]

I ask the same question today. This Tory Government has shown complete contempt for some of the most vulnerable in our society and seems willing to push ahead with no regard for the misery that it is going to inflict.

I remind the chamber that, during the summer, I wrote to every MP in the UK, asking them to support a call to halt the roll-out of universal credit. I wrote to the work and pensions secretary, who, in fairness, got back to me in reply. However, his defence of the roll-out stated that the evidence from Citizens Advice Scotland was

“based on evidence from a self-selecting group of people”.

I take it that he meant the very people who have experienced being part of the roll-out.

I also wrote to the leader of the Scottish Tories, Ruth Davidson, but have had no response to date. The Tories here in Scotland seem to want to bury their heads in the sand. Do they really not care about what is happening to those who are suffering under the policy as it is rolled out across Scotland? We see another weak-willed defence of the roll-out from the Scottish Tories today.

In the same item of business

The Deputy Presiding Officer (Christine Grahame) SNP
The next item of business is a debate on motion S5M-08035, in the name of Jeane Freeman, on the roll-out of universal credit. I call Jeane Freeman to speak t...
The Minister for Social Security (Jeane Freeman) SNP
I have brought the motion to the chamber today to allow the Scottish Parliament to make clear its position on universal credit and to give Parliament the opp...
Jeremy Balfour (Lothian) (Con) Con
Does the minister welcome the statement made at the Conservative Party conference yesterday that the wait will be a maximum of five days? Will she welcome th...
Jeane Freeman SNP
Actually, what was mentioned at the Conservative Party conference—believe me, I will get to it—was what we already have. The only new thing that was said was...
Adam Tomkins (Glasgow) (Con) Con
In the words of the Joseph Rowntree Foundation, the current system, which universal credit is replacing, is “fragmented and traps people in poverty.” If un...
Jeane Freeman SNP
The Joseph Rowntree Foundation, which I know Mr Tomkins is very fond of quoting, called on the Conservatives to reverse the two-child limit. Originally, the ...
Adam Tomkins (Glasgow) (Con) Con
Presiding Officer, “Universal Credit ... remains the right thing to do. The current system is fragmented and traps people in poverty. The prospect of an int...
Iain Gray (East Lothian) (Lab) Lab
In East Lothian, prior to the roll-out of universal credit, rent arrears had fallen by 20 per cent; on its introduction, rent arrears increased by 20 per cen...
Adam Tomkins Con
The DWP addressed the detail of that point in its responses to the Social Security Community. There was a particular problem in East Lothian, which was one o...
Maree Todd (Highlands and Islands) (SNP) SNP
Will the member take an intervention?
Adam Tomkins Con
No. On 14 March, the responsible minister, Damian Hinds MP, wrote to the Social Security Committee. He said: “I accept there are cases where claimants wait...
Jeane Freeman SNP
Will the member take an intervention?
Adam Tomkins Con
I will if I have time.
The Deputy Presiding Officer SNP
There is time for interventions for everyone in this debate.
Jeane Freeman SNP
Does Mr Tomkins accept that the DWP’s information that was released this year shows that one in four new UC claimants waits longer than six weeks, half of cl...
Adam Tomkins Con
That was more a speech than an intervention. The answer is straightforward. There is an interest-free loan, which needs to be paid back over a six-month per...
Alex Rowley (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Lab) Lab
When the Parliament last debated universal credit, a few weeks ago, I said that I would welcome a Government debate on the issue, so I am glad to be speaking...
Maurice Golden (West Scotland) (Con) Con
Does the member agree that the best way out of poverty is to work and that people who claim universal credit are 13 per cent more likely to be in work than p...
Alex Rowley Lab
Skills opportunities and employment are, for me, the best way out of poverty—I do not disagree with that. However, we need to provide support. It is clear th...
Alison Johnstone (Lothian) (Green) Green
This is the second time in less than a month that the Parliament has debated the roll-out of universal credit. That is a clear reflection of the extraordinar...
Adam Tomkins Con
I am very grateful to the member for taking an intervention. One of the recent changes to universal credit has been the change in the taper rate from 65 per ...
Alison Johnstone Green
Yes, I agree, but that amounted to £0.7 billion, compared with an initial £3 billion cut. Research by the OBR shows that, by 2020, universal credit will tak...
Alex Cole-Hamilton (Edinburgh Western) (LD) LD
I welcome the Scottish Government’s motion and the opportunity that it affords the chamber to call a halt to the botched accelerated roll-out of universal cr...
The Deputy Presiding Officer SNP
We move to the open debate. 16:08
Sandra White (Glasgow Kelvin) (SNP) SNP
It is important to remind members, particularly the Tories, that today we are discussing human beings and their situation; we are discussing not statistics, ...
Jeremy Balfour (Lothian) (Con) Con
I welcome the amendment in my colleague Adam Tomkins’s name and I fully support it. I suspect that there will not be a lot of consensus from other parties ab...
Jeane Freeman SNP
Will the member take an intervention?
Ruth Maguire (Cunninghame South) (SNP) SNP
Will the member give way?
Jeremy Balfour Con
Not at the moment. I will make some progress first, if that is okay. We have heard much about the great old system that we all loved so much—six forms, six ...
Sandra White SNP
Will the member give way?