Hansard

The background to the debate, as was set out by Bruce Crawford a few moments ago, is the written agreement that has been established between the Scottish Parliament and Scottish Government on intergovernmental relations.

Intergovernmental relations between the UK Government and the Scottish Government are now more important than ever. Further devolution has created what is, in effect, a quasi-federal state within the UK. Scotland has two Governments: the Government here in Edinburgh and the Government in London, each of which has different competencies at different levels. There will be a wide range of issues on which it will be important that both Scotland’s Governments work closely together, so there needs to be high-quality engagement between them.

In addition, there needs to be effective scrutiny of intergovernmental relations at parliamentary level, both at Westminster and here in the Scottish Parliament. That point was recognised by the Devolution (Further Powers) Committee, which produced a very helpful report on the issues in October last year. In taking evidence for its report the committee heard from a number of experts about the weakness of parliamentary scrutiny of intergovernmental relations. For example, Professor Michael Keating of the University of Edinburgh’s centre for constitutional change said:

“We have very poor parliamentary scrutiny of intergovernmental relations” —[Official Report, Devolution (Further Powers) Committee, 19 March 2015; c 12.]

Research that was carried out for the committee showed that in a range of other federal, or quasi-federal, states the role of Parliaments in scrutinising intergovernmental relations was greater than it is in the UK.

The House of Lords Constitution Committee, which also considered the issues, stated in its report “Inter-governmental relations in the United Kingdom”, that

“Effective scrutiny of inter-governmental relations requires both greater transparency than currently exists, and the necessary structures and desire in Parliament and the devolved legislatures to scrutinise those relationships.”

The written agreement between the Scottish Parliament and the Scottish Government was entered into in response to those concerns.

The agreement requires the Scottish Government to provide, in so far as doing so is practicable, to the relevant committee of Parliament advance written notice of at least one month prior to scheduled meetings. That will enable the relevant committee to express a view on the topic and, if appropriate, to invite the responsible minister to attend a committee meeting to address the issue and answer questions. That reflects the conclusion of the Devolution (Further Powers) Committee, that the view of the Scottish Parliament needs to be taken into account before any intergovernmental agreement is entered into by the Scottish Government.

The key is transparency. In the Finance and Constitution Committee’s engagement with the Cabinet Secretary for Finance and the Constitution we have so far established what I think is a positive working relationship, in which the cabinet secretary is prepared to engage with the committee on intergovernmental dealings with Westminster. I hope that that is the case for all cabinet secretaries, although it is worth noting in passing that concern has been raised in other quarters about the lack of information that has been provided about the transfer of welfare powers to this Parliament—an issue that surely falls under the definition of intergovernmental relations.

We know that Scottish Government ministers often use intergovernmental meetings to raise concerns that they have about UK Government policy in reserved matters. I asked the Cabinet Secretary for Finance and the Constitution at a recent committee meeting whether that process ever happens in reverse. That does not seem to have been the case with either the current or previous UK Governments, although Michael Russell has told me that Jim Murphy, when he was the Secretary of State for Scotland in the previous Labour Government, was not shy about using such meetings to berate the SNP Administration at Holyrood for what he saw as its policy failures. Clearly, Conservatives in Government are more courteous. [Laughter.]

I want to make one other point before closing. The Devolution (Further Powers) Committee recommended that greater interparliamentary co-operation in scrutinising intergovernmental relations would be beneficial, so I look forward to seeing a work stream develop in which committees of this Parliament can work more closely with committees at Westminster and elsewhere than has been the case in the past.

I suspect that this debate will not make tomorrow’s front pages, but it has been a useful opportunity to air important points about the machinery of government. I am pleased to support the motion in the Bruce Crawford’s name.