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Chamber

Meeting of the Parliament 01 March 2016

01 Mar 2016 · S4 · Meeting of the Parliament
Item of business
Work, Wages and Wellbeing

I thank the Economy, Energy and Tourism Committee for an important and timely report that builds on the work that the committee did previously on underemployment. Just how necessary the report is was brought home by the rather alarming extract from the cabinet secretary’s evidence. The report states:

“The Cabinet Secretary for Fair Work, Skills and Training said that she did ‘not like’ any of the definitions she had seen of fair work, and felt it was a highly subjective area. She suggested that it is ‘much easier to see a bad job than provide a hard and fast definition of a good job or fair work’”.

The cabinet secretary for fair work admits that she is unsure what fair work is. There is a temptation to go down the rhetorical route and ask whether the cabinet secretary for education knows what education is or the Cabinet Secretary for Justice has any idea about justice. However, that would be a bit unfair, because the cabinet secretary for fair work was showing some welcome honesty about the complexities of fair work.

It would be good if the Government demonstrated the same honesty when it comes to the monthly reporting of labour market statistics. When those statistics come out, we often see hyperbolic claims about a return to pre-recession employment levels or record employment rates in particular areas, but the committee’s report makes it clear that there is rather less to that than meets the eye. It says:

“The majority of evidence suggested a deterioration in job quality. In particular, we heard of an increase in poor-quality, low-paid and insecure work, and a worrying prevalence of the use of exploitative zero-hours contracts.”

In other words, there might be more jobs, but the quality of those jobs leaves a great deal to be desired.

For a long time, we in the Labour Party have been saying that, when it comes to labour market statistics, we have to look behind the headlines. That is not just because the numbers tell us something different but because behind those headlines are the real-life lived experiences of many people who are struggling to get by in low-quality, poorly paid jobs.

I was struck by one example in the report that comes from my constituency of East Lothian. A legal secretary explained:

“I was taken on in 2008 with the promise of being trained as a paralegal, then the recession hit and 7 years later I’m still an unqualified secretary, can’t get a job elsewhere but haven’t progressed in this one. I am given too much responsibility but no reward, paid just enough to not be entitled to ANY tax credits but not enough to actually live off, or work towards a mortgage, or pay off any debt. The Company I work for takes full advantage of the fact the people are terrified to leave but there is no future in the role.”

That is the reality behind the statistics. We should not lose sight of the report’s recommendations about improving the quality of the labour market statistics. The cabinet secretary is quoted in the report as accepting that the data is broad brush and that

“it could be hard to break data down to a useful level, noting for instance that even working one or two hours a week would see someone classed as being in employment.”

In the same item of business

The Presiding Officer (Tricia Marwick) NPA
The next item of business is a debate on motion S4M-15760, in the name of Murdo Fraser, on work, wages and wellbeing in the Scottish labour market. I call Mu...
Murdo Fraser (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Con) Con
On behalf of the Economy, Energy and Tourism Committee, I express our gratitude for the opportunity to debate what for us has been an extensive, exciting and...
The Cabinet Secretary for Fair Work, Skills and Training (Roseanna Cunningham) SNP
I, too, thank the Economy, Energy and Tourism Committee for the report and for inviting me to give evidence for the inquiry. I listened with interest to Murd...
John Wilson (Central Scotland) (Ind) Ind
The minister mentioned inappropriate use of zero-hours contracts. Will she define the fair use of zero-hours contracts?
Roseanna Cunningham SNP
There has been quite a discussion about that. I am not quite sure, because I am not up on my football, but I think that I have seen Ann Budge from Hearts mak...
The Deputy Presiding Officer (Elaine Smith) Lab
I can give you an extra minute.
Roseanna Cunningham SNP
Thank you, Presiding Officer. We do not yet have Scotland-specific figures, but the Equality and Human Rights Commission has reported that, across Britain, ...
Iain Gray (East Lothian) (Lab) Lab
I thank the Economy, Energy and Tourism Committee for an important and timely report that builds on the work that the committee did previously on underemploy...
Roseanna Cunningham SNP
I hope that Iain Gray will acknowledge that the data that comes out is UK-wide data that is broken down for Scotland. The statistics are official statistics ...
Iain Gray Lab
I accept that, but I will make two points. First, the report makes it clear that the Scottish Government pays the Office for National Statistics to do additi...
Gavin Brown (Lothian) (Con) Con
The Economy, Energy and Tourism Committee has produced a pretty comprehensive and effective report. The committee took a huge amount of evidence, with 11 pan...
The Deputy Presiding Officer Lab
We turn to the open debate. I am afraid that there is not much time in hand, and speeches should be of four minutes. 14:50
Gordon MacDonald (Edinburgh Pentlands) (SNP) SNP
The overall employment situation in Scotland continues to improve. The latest figures highlight that we have record levels of employment and that those level...
Gavin Brown Con
Will the member give way?
Gordon MacDonald SNP
No—I have only four minutes. The Poverty Alliance continued: “It is also difficult to imagine how anyone is meant to manage their finances week to week wit...
Johann Lamont (Glasgow Pollok) (Lab) Lab
I welcome the opportunity to participate in the debate on an important report. Regardless of the previous speaker’s characterisation of it, the report was ma...
Christian Allard (North East Scotland) (SNP) SNP
I wanted to congratulate the Economy, Energy and Tourism Committee and its convener on their choice of title for their report, but Gavin Brown has prevented ...
John Pentland (Motherwell and Wishaw) (Lab) Lab
In general, I welcome the recommendations of this report, which back up many of the things that Scottish Labour has been saying for some time. The Scottish G...
Richard Lyle (Central Scotland) (SNP) SNP
As a member of the Parliament’s Economy, Energy and Tourism Committee, I am delighted to speak in this debate on work, wages and wellbeing in the Scottish la...
The Deputy Presiding Officer Lab
I call John Wilson. I ask you to keep to your four minutes please, Mr Wilson. 15:12
John Wilson (Central Scotland) (Ind) Ind
First, I declare an interest as a member of Unite the union and as a former director of the Scottish Low Pay Unit. I commend the Economy, Energy and Tourism ...
The Deputy Presiding Officer Lab
We turn to closing speeches. I remind members who participated in the debate that they should be here for closing speeches. 15:16
Gavin Brown Con
This has been an interesting debate. I will return to some of the excellent contributions that were made, but before I do that I will pick up on two points. ...
Christian Allard SNP
I was talking about taxation and the high road and the low road, and I gave some European Union examples. Does Gavin Brown not agree that whereas France has ...
Gavin Brown Con
In all honesty, I genuinely do not understand the point that Christian Allard is making. I point out a host of areas in which successive UK Governments of di...
Lewis Macdonald (North East Scotland) (Lab) Lab
As members have said, work, wages and wellbeing matter to us all. What people do when they get to work, how much and how they are paid, how they are treated ...
Roseanna Cunningham SNP
I thank the committee again for its valuable piece of work, and I thank all the people who took the time to give evidence. I will send the committee my respo...
The Deputy Presiding Officer Lab
I call Joan McAlpine to wind up the debate on behalf of the Economy, Energy and Tourism Committee. 15:30
Joan McAlpine (South Scotland) (SNP) SNP
This has been a worthwhile debate on a worthwhile committee report, and that is important given the issues at stake and the level of engagement that the comm...