Committee
Health and Sport Committee 09 February 2016
09 Feb 2016 · S4 · Health and Sport Committee
Item of business
Penrose Inquiry
Bill Wright
Watch on SPTV
In the time that was taken a substantial body of evidence was collected. Much of it was new evidence of which we had not previously been aware. The inquiry team secured and examined well over 100,000 documents and had about 89 days of oral hearings. Obviously, the team gathered a lot of facts. Whether the inquiry was then able to find some explanation for those facts is an entirely different matter. In the report of the Penrose inquiry, the word “could” appears very regularly throughout; it says, for example, that in the chairman’s view certain steps “could” have been taken, rather than that they “should” have been taken. Penrose gathered a body of evidence on much of the story, but he did not explain considerable amounts of it, such as what happened in relation to medical records and why United Kingdom civil servants attempted to render Crown immunity, which was an extremely savage tool to use against anybody who wanted to look into the matter. It was clear that UK civil servants at the time were feeling highly insecure about their position. There was no examination of that particular issue, for example, which indicates insecurity on the Government’s part. As Philip Dolan mentioned, no evidence was taken from, for example, Dr David Owen. In fact, on the day when the report was released, a retired civil servant phoned us up because he was concerned about the manner in which the issue had been dealt with. The answer to your question is that we did not get the complete picture, but we got a much bigger picture than we had had previously. However, once that body of evidence had been put together, not a great deal of judgment was exercised. There was no set of conclusions and there was but one single recommendation, which seems to be extremely odd, given the cost of the exercise and the time involved.
In the same item of business
The Convener
Lab
We move to our second agenda item, on the final report of the Penrose inquiry. We will hear oral evidence on the report from Petra Wright. Should that be Bil...
Petra Wright (Hepatitis C Trust)
We are not related.
Bill Wright (Haemophilia Scotland)
Fond of her as I am, convener, we are not brother and sister, or whatever.
The Convener
Lab
Petra Wright is Scottish officer for the Hepatitis C Trust, Philip Dolan is the convener of the Scottish Infected Blood Forum, and Bill Wright is chair of Ha...
Richard Lyle (Central Scotland) (SNP)
SNP
First, I thank you, convener, and the committee for holding this evidence session. I am sure that many people who have been affected by the issues that are b...
Bill Wright
The committee will be well aware that, among those of us who endured the six-year-long inquiry, the common phrase that was used was that it was a “whitewash”...
Philip Dolan (Scottish Infected Blood Forum)
I agree with many of the things that Bill Wright has said. I have written a history of the subject, and I feel like I have been haunting this place and the c...
The Convener
Lab
I will let Petra Wright respond to the first question, and then I will take some supplementaries on the inquiry process. After that, I will allow the witness...
Petra Wright
I was not personally involved in the Penrose inquiry, but I would like to comment on it. Richard Lyle mentioned the length of time that the process has take...
The Convener
Lab
Do other members have questions on the process of the inquiry?
Malcolm Chisholm (Edinburgh Northern and Leith) (Lab)
Lab
I also want to ask about something else, but I will stick to that issue for the moment. I totally take on board what the witnesses have said and I understan...
Bill Wright
No—
The Convener
Lab
Just a minute, Mr Wright. Do members have any other questions on the theme of the inquiry and its outcomes? No? Okay—go ahead, Mr Wright.
Bill Wright
In the time that was taken a substantial body of evidence was collected. Much of it was new evidence of which we had not previously been aware. The inquiry t...
Philip Dolan
I feel most strongly about the fact that during the six years—or whatever length of time it was—the victims were not listened to, and that during the year or...
The Convener
Lab
Richard Lyle will take us on to the next topic.
Richard Lyle
SNP
Thank you for sharing your experience with us, Mr Dolan. Sadly, I have heard the same from other sufferers all too often. Was it a weakness that the Penrose ...
Philip Dolan
Many years ago, there was an inquiry about BSE in England, which was chaired by a Scottish judge. At the end, the inquiry came out and said that it blamed th...
Bill Wright
The question illustrates the shortcomings in the inquiry system that I alluded to. We can look at a number of inquiries. I understand that a former First Min...
The Convener
Lab
Richard Lyle has a third and final question to move us on in this theme.
Richard Lyle
SNP
Dennis Robertson has a question, so I will let him in first.
Dennis Robertson (Aberdeenshire West) (SNP)
SNP
It is just a quick supplementary question on death certificates. You are saying that the cause of death could have been hepatitis C or whatever but, because ...
Bill Wright
Some improvements have been made. Previously, anybody who was medically qualified could write a death certificate. However, the legacy for us has been consid...
Petra Wright
Many deaths that were attributable to hepatitis C have been attributed to other things. Since hepatitis C became known about, evidence has emerged about area...
Bill Wright
Could I follow up on that, please?
The Convener
Lab
Yes, but you are taking time from some of the other questions.
Bill Wright
It brings us to the next issue, convener, which is financial recognition. There is a surprising frequency of death from cerebral brain haemorrhage being rec...
The Convener
Lab
Some of that is reflected in the written evidence, of course, but it is good to get it on the record.
Philip Dolan
I want to pick up on one specific point. During the inquiry, when expert witnesses came in, there were three or four doctors who all sat close together givin...
Richard Lyle
SNP
I have been involved with the issue for the past few years. Last year, I had the opportunity to go and see the emotional and hard-hitting play “Factor 9”, wh...