Hansard

The Health and Sport Committee focused in particular on the provisions relating to pregnancy loss, stillbirth and infant loss, and heard a great deal about the poor practices of the past, which the bill must ensure are kept very firmly in the past. I thank everyone who gave evidence to us, particularly those parents who had suffered a terrible loss. I also want to mention not just those who gave evidence on the record but the several parents from SANDS Lothian whom I found extremely powerful and helpful in a private meeting that they had with three committee members.

We can try to emphasise with parents in those situations of loss, but we cannot know how it feels, which is why we must listen very carefully to what they say. One of the key points that came across in the meeting with SANDS Lothian was the importance of training for staff, because so much depends on that. Particularly after the loss, what the staff say to the woman affected is absolutely crucial. SANDS Lothian parents also emphasised the importance of developing specialist roles in midwifery, maternity and bereavement services, which I found very powerful evidence.

Like the others who gave evidence on the record, those parents were very concerned about the issue of ashes. I think that most of them agree about the definition in the bill, but one important point that came across from several of the parents is that we must ensure that it says on the statutory application forms for carrying out a burial that there is an expectation that ashes will be recovered. People were concerned that the policy memorandum emphasised that they might not be recovered—that was another key point that came across.

People also said that it was important to set out policies on the disposal of ashes. I think that the minister said that an amendment would come forward on that. I wonder whether there could be something in the codes of practice about processes and equipment in crematoriums so that we have the best possible procedures to ensure that the maximum amount of ashes are recovered.

On what happens on pregnancy loss, I was glad to hear the minister say that the woman would be at the centre of decision making. We as a committee were concerned about the timescales for decision making. I heard the minister say that there could be more time if circumstances allowed, but I hope that the flexibility will also allow less time. We heard that some women, for personal or cultural reasons, might want to make a definitive decision in a much shorter period than the seven days that are prescribed as the minimum period in the bill. I think that that is an important point.

In terms of the death of a child or infant, or a stillborn child, we should remember that that includes medical terminations after 24 weeks. I was glad to hear the minister say something that I think means that she is committed to achieving confidentiality in those circumstances, which is an issue that we were concerned about. NHS Lothian was concerned about the assumption of private family responsibility in those situations and said that that is not what happens in practice. It is important that the woman is supported in that situation, too, in terms of decision making and arrangements.

There was quite a lot of discussion about the statutory forms for carrying out a burial. I think that most of the people giving evidence thought that there should be different forms for different circumstances. The committee was concerned—perhaps the minister could refer to this in her winding-up speech—that there should not be an offence for helping someone to fill in a form. However, clearly it should be an offence if misleading or incorrect information is given.

We made the recommendation that the licensing of funeral directors should be on the face of the bill, but I imagine that because of the timescales that will not be possible. However, Willie Reid, who gave very powerful evidence, was very strong on the need for the licensing of funeral directors and emphasised that the register should be kept in electronic form.

As I said at the beginning, let us make sure that the poor practices of the past are consigned to the past as a result of the passing of the bill.