Hansard

The Deputy Presiding Officer (John Scott) Con

The next item of business is a debate on motion S4M-15220, in the name of Joe FitzPatrick. 15:16

The Minister for Parliamentary Business (Joe FitzPatrick) SNP

The Lobbying (Scotland) Bill is an unusual bill: it has been introduced by the Government, but is parliamentary in nature. For that reason, I have been keen ...

Neil Findlay (Lothian) (Lab) Lab

I would like to exemplify the point. If the minister has a problem with a product that he has bought or a bill that he gets and he has to contact a company t...

Joe FitzPatrick SNP

As I said, the Government is keeping an open mind on the issue. Our starting point in attempting to provide a proportionate response has been to consider wha...

Neil Findlay Lab

Again, I ask a question: is most of our time taken up meeting people face to face or is most of our time taken up dealing with communications of another type?

Joe FitzPatrick SNP

We would all have to go and look at our diaries to work out how much time we spend meeting people. I am clear in my view that face-to-face lobbying is the mo...

Mary Fee (West Scotland) (Lab) Lab

I thank the minister for taking another intervention. I will be very brief. Will the minister clarify in what form were the bulk of the communications that h...

The Deputy Presiding Officer Con

I will give you extra time, minister.

Joe FitzPatrick SNP

Okay. In terms of volume, I—like every other member—have probably received the greater volume in the form of emails, which is significant. However, in terms ...

Neil Findlay Lab

Because your staff read the emails.

Joe FitzPatrick SNP

I think that I, myself, have read every single email that has come in about the bill. I will continue: I have had meetings with stakeholders on all sides of...

John Wilson (Central Scotland) (Ind) Ind

Would the minister make a distinction between lobbying and organised lobbying? The majority of emails that I have had this week on the bill, and those on oth...

Joe FitzPatrick SNP

I am conscious that I should make some progress, but that is absolutely the case, and the bill as drafted makes that distinction, which is very important. T...

Stewart Stevenson (Banffshire and Buchan Coast) (SNP) SNP

The term “lobbying” can, for some people at least, conjure up images of dubious characters loitering in the corridors of power, attempting to gain unfair adv...

Chic Brodie (South Scotland) (SNP) SNP

Warren Buffet once said that the contribution of people, particularly those in public service, requires integrity, intellect and energy, and without the firs...

Stewart Stevenson SNP

The committee’s view is that we need to seek to differentiate between lobbyists who lobby as part of their paid activity and those individuals and organisati...

Neil Findlay Lab

Having read the committee’s stage 1 report, I understand that it rejected thresholds for registration. That was an error. Having thresholds would have meant ...

Stewart Stevenson SNP

There was an element of judgment; there is no absolute certainty in this. However, the test of including only people who receive reward for their lobbying is...

The Deputy Presiding Officer Con

You have nine minutes, Mr Stevenson, but there is a little flexibility.

Stewart Stevenson SNP

Thank you—that is helpful. We looked at the distinction that the bill makes between paid and unpaid lobbying. We basically endorsed the Government’s approac...

Neil Findlay (Lothian) (Lab) Lab

I am pleased to open the debate on behalf on the Labour Party. I am also pleased that the Government has got round to introducing the bill, because this deba...

Chic Brodie SNP

Not here.

Neil Findlay Lab

Calm your jets, Mr Brodie. After all those things and the current financial controversies of some MPs, that general standing is not high. Thankfully, the Pa...

Joe FitzPatrick SNP

It is not the case that the Government does not recognise those other forms of lobbying. Indeed, the bill allows for the Parliament to put in place guidance ...

Neil Findlay Lab

I thank the minister for confirming that he is not a Luddite and that he is a modern man in the modern age. I am sure that he will want to ensure that the bi...

Cameron Buchanan (Lothian) (Con) Con

I, too, am glad that we have the chance to debate the Lobbying (Scotland) Bill and all of the possible routes to take. If we are to achieve the cross-party c...

The Deputy Presiding Officer (Elaine Smith) Lab

We turn to the open debate, with speeches of six minutes or so. At this stage, there is a bit of time in hand for interventions. 16:00

George Adam (Paisley) (SNP) SNP

I was a member of the Standards, Procedures and Public Appointments Committee during the original inquiry into lobbying and while most of the work on the iss...

Neil Findlay Lab

Will Mr Adam take an intervention?

George Adam SNP

Can I just get this point across, Mr Findlay? The bill as it stands will make it difficult for local employers and small businesses to contact me. Some smal...