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Chamber

Meeting of the Parliament 23 June 2015

23 Jun 2015 · S4 · Meeting of the Parliament
Item of business
Prisoners (Control of Release) (Scotland) Bill

We must acknowledge that the bill has moved since stage 1 and that it operates in the context of the 2007 and 2010 legislation in the area, as yet to be implemented, and, of course, the McLeish commission. It is not and does not purport to be a bill about clarity in sentencing. The sentencing council will no doubt help in that area in due course, and we should wish that new body well. The bill is not the last word on automatic early release, either. That is absolutely clear. However, it is clear that the bill represents a first step along the way of ending automatic release and reversing the Tory policy of 1993.

We ought to recognise the Government’s response to criticism of what was described as “cold release”. We should also recognise what Dr Barry described as the need for

“proactive support in relation to accommodation, employment, education, benefits and so on.” —[Official Report, Justice Committee, 13 January 2015; c 7.]

We should bear in mind the need for throughcare for offenders returning to the community.

We should welcome the commitment by the Scottish Prison Service to providing 42 officers to support offenders to reintegrate back into the community, building on the work already begun in prison that the cabinet secretary referred to earlier.

There is a need to ensure that there are adequate numbers of programmes available to offenders within prison to enable them to change their behaviour. Yes, there are challenges and those programmes will need to be adequately resourced, but we have time to plan for this adequately. Indeed, as the cabinet secretary said during the stage 1 debate, an independent review of prison programmes, including psychological programmes, will be carried out. It is not helpful to highlight the possible ECHR challenges that might take place if programmes are not in place; rather, we need to allow the Scottish Prison Service to get its house in order.

The Government always recognised that any reduction to the period of automatic release might incentivise participation in programmes and any planning needs to take account of that. In that context, let us bear in mind that planning can be complex. Eric Murch of the Scottish Prison Service commented:

“Some prisoners will deny that they have a problem until very close to their critical date and then they will try to move up the list.” —[Official Report, Justice Committee, 24 February 2015; c 46.]

Is six months of guaranteed supervision adequate? We have heard a lot of debate about that and there is a variety of views. We know the position of Colin McConnell and Sacro, and we know that others take a different view. That was debated earlier, so I will not repeat the arguments, but I point out that the academics accept that the highest risk period is immediately after release even if they do not accept that that is the only period when support is required.

We reached a decision on that period earlier, and I have no doubt that courts will take account of the provisions and the alternatives, such as the increased use of extended sentences, at the appropriate time.

Some of the academic critics of the bill would, if their wishes were granted, simply succeed in kicking matters into the long grass. At stage 1 even Margaret Mitchell suggested that that was a real danger, and in February Sarah Crombie of Victim Support Scotland said that that would cause that organisation concern. Despite the academics, we need to grasp the nettle.

Public safety remains important. I am not sure what the frequently mentioned empirical evidence would show—if it were ever to be obtained—except that this group of prisoners will no longer be sent out to the community, come what may, at the two-thirds mark of their sentence.

The Parole Board will have a greater role than it does now. Public safety will not be reduced. Let us also not forget the availability of extended sentences to courts at the time of sentencing. That will provide additional protection for the public in appropriate cases.

Concerns have been expressed about the financial costs of the legislation by 2030-31. That is a long way off and much can happen in the interim. I hope that it will encourage further thought to be given as to the appropriateness of many short sentences, which, as we know, often do not act as a deterrent and certainly do not provide adequate time for rehabilitation.

Despite its critics, the bill has considerable value and I commend it to the Parliament.

In the same item of business

The Deputy Presiding Officer (John Scott) Con
The next item of business is a debate on motion S4M-13597, in the name of Michael Matheson, on the Prisoners (Control of Release) (Scotland) Bill. 15:22
The Cabinet Secretary for Justice (Michael Matheson) SNP
I welcome the opportunity to open the stage 3 debate on the Prisoners (Control of Release) (Scotland) Bill. First, I offer my thanks to the Justice Committee...
The Deputy Presiding Officer Con
I call Dr Elaine Murray. You have seven minutes. As we are now quite tight for time, please make it a pretty exact seven minutes. 15:32
Elaine Murray (Dumfriesshire) (Lab) Lab
The term “ending automatic early release” has been used so often over the years that its meaning has not been questioned. That was the case until the Justice...
Christian Allard (North East Scotland) (SNP) SNP
Will the member take an intervention?
Elaine Murray Lab
No, sorry. I do not really have much time. In the ministerial statement prior to this debate, Fergus Ewing reminded us that irrational decisions can result ...
John Finnie (Highlands and Islands) (Ind) Ind
Will the member give way?
Elaine Murray Lab
I am sorry, but I do not have much time. The Government has not been able to provide evidence that a six-month supervisory sentence for all long-term prison...
Margaret Mitchell (Central Scotland) (Con) Con
I pay tribute to the Justice Committee clerks for their hard work and to the witnesses who provided such vital and insightful evidence at stage 1 and stage 2...
Christian Allard SNP
Will the member give way?
Margaret Mitchell Con
If Mr Allard does not mind, I will make progress. We are now in a situation in which the legitimate concerns and criticisms of stakeholders, which range fro...
Christian Allard SNP
Will the member take an intervention?
Margaret Mitchell Con
No. If the member does not mind, I have some progress to make. That in turn has proportionality implications that may lead to potential human rights challen...
Roderick Campbell (North East Fife) (SNP) SNP
We must acknowledge that the bill has moved since stage 1 and that it operates in the context of the 2007 and 2010 legislation in the area, as yet to be impl...
The Deputy Presiding Officer (Elaine Smith) Lab
I have a little bit of time in hand at this stage. 15:48
Graeme Pearson (South Scotland) (Lab) Lab
I am pleased to speak in this afternoon’s debate. However, I am disappointed because introducing the legislation in this way is a missed opportunity. Rod Ca...
Christian Allard SNP
It is important to understand what the academics told the committee. They said that cold release is the problem. A vast amount of cold release is happening. ...
Graeme Pearson Lab
I am grateful for that intervention. I accept that the days of cold release should be history. Unfortunately, they will not be. Over the past few months, I h...
Alison McInnes (North East Scotland) (LD) LD
It is important to remember that automatic early release is a management device. It was introduced as a safety valve to ease the pressure caused by escalatin...
John Finnie (Highlands and Islands) (Ind) Ind
The policy memorandum talks about helping to reduce offending and improve public safety, and it is important that we have an evidence base for that. People h...
Christine Grahame (Midlothian South, Tweeddale and Lauderdale) (SNP) SNP
Much has already been said about this short bill, so I will try not to repeat too much. I think that we all agree that ending automatic early release is, in ...
Jayne Baxter (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Lab) Lab
The core principle behind the bill is recognised across the chamber: automatic early release of prisoners does not engender confidence in our criminal justic...
John Finnie Ind
Will Jayne Baxter give way?
Jayne Baxter Lab
No. We must ensure that each offender’s risk profile is central to the debate about whether they are released early. For those who have committed serious of...
The Deputy Presiding Officer Lab
We come to the closing speeches. I call Margaret Mitchell. 16:10
Margaret Mitchell Con
Oh, it is me. I thought I heard “followed by”. If the decision to pass the bill is taken at 4.30 pm, the Parliament will be able to take absolutely no pride...
Hugh Henry (Renfrewshire South) (Lab) Lab
I cannot find any fault in the idea that we should end automatic early release. Victims, and indeed the general public, deserve some clarity from our legal s...
Christian Allard SNP
Will the member give way?
Hugh Henry Lab
No, thank you. Roderick Campbell criticised Elaine Murray, saying that there was no evidence for her amendment. That was echoed by Christine Grahame, who sa...
Michael Matheson SNP
I have listened with interest to the issues and points raised, although some of them were echoes of concerns that were raised at stage 1 of the bill. I said ...