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Chamber

Meeting of the Parliament 17 June 2014

17 Jun 2014 · S4 · Meeting of the Parliament
Item of business
Asylum Seekers and Refugees
McKelvie, Christina SNP Hamilton, Larkhall and Stonehouse Watch on SPTV

It is not often that we take part in a debate that has the words “asylum seekers and refugees” and “humane system” in the same sentence. I want to focus on the issue of showing humanity and what that means.

About 13 years ago, when I was a Unison steward, I had a briefing from Margaret Wood of the Glasgow campaign to welcome refugees, and from that moment on I was involved in the campaign. At the same time, the Scottish Refugee Council started raising awareness, and I am very proud of this Parliament and this nation for marking refugee week every year.

One thing that was drawn to my attention when I worked in social work in Glasgow was the checks that young refugees were put through to determine their age. I do not mean to be totally alarmist, but the checks would have put Nazi Germany to shame, because wrists were measured, X-rays were taken and dental work was checked in order to determine a young person’s age—instead of just speaking to them and treating them as human.

Then we had the group who were fondly known as the Glasgow girls, whom we should all be very proud of, and their campaign against dawn raids. We witnessed on our tellies almost every night the people of Drumchapel, Castlemilk, Springburn and Sighthill standing up to UK Border Agency detention vans. Women in those areas were presented with Scottish women of the year awards. That shows a different Glasgow that is humane. Was the treatment of the refugees humane? That is the question.

I turn to the issue of Dungavel. For many years I have attended vigils at Dungavel run by justice and peace organisations from Lanarkshire and Ayrshire. The detention of innocent kids in Dungavel was brought to my attention because they were put next to some of the most notorious child traffickers in the world, who were awaiting deportation. Is that humane? I do not think so.

We should remember that those children are not criminals. I say to Alison McInnes that, although the Lib Dems ended the detention of children at Dungavel, the children just get shipped to Yarl’s Wood, Colnbrook or another centre. That is not a last resort. If members just listen to the testimony of people I know, they will hear that that is not a last resort.

UK Governments of all colours have been playing top trumps to see who is the hardest on immigrants, who is the hardest on asylum seekers and who is the hardest on refugees. Some of the things that I have seen over the years make me sick to my stomach.

Successive UK Governments have refused to sign up to EU directives to protect people, whether they are on asylum, men’s violence against women and children or trafficking. We have had go home vans and adverts. How disgusting.

The UKBA determines asylum status along with trafficked status and can deny a person protection all in the one envelope. That is disgusting and is not humane.

We have people who have been forced into destitution. We had the obscene pictures on our telly of Jacqui Smith chartering a plane, rounding up women and children at Brand Street in Govan, sending them back to the war-torn Democratic Republic of Congo and telling them, “There, there—it’ll be all right once you’re home.”

We have the situation of young women from Moldova. Last week, we in the Parliament viewed the film “Nefarious: Merchant of Souls”. A young woman who was trafficked across Europe in horrific circumstances was brought to London. She was saved by the Poppy project, but she was denied refugee status and trafficked status and was sent back to Moldova. The decision was that she was not at risk. When she got there, the traffickers caught up with her. They abused her, beat her and did horrific things to her. A few months later, where was she? She was trafficked back to London. Is that humane? No.

Having an independent Scotland is one way to change that. We can have a humane system—a new asylum model that separates immigration from people who seek sanctuary. One of the most disgusting things about the process is the fact that people conflate those things, which dehumanises the individuals who are involved.

I want a system that provides protection, shows compassion and gives people dignity and support. I want a Scottish asylum agency that is underpinned by all those values and based on human rights. That is humane. That is the kind of Scotland that I want to live in.

15:57

In the same item of business

The Deputy Presiding Officer (Elaine Smith) Lab
The next item of business is a debate on motion S4M-10347, in the name of Humza Yousaf, on asylum seekers and refugees: the need to create a more humane syst...
The Minister for External Affairs and International Development (Humza Yousaf) SNP
Last night, I had the enormous pleasure of speaking at the launch of refugee week Scotland 2014 at the stunning venue of the Old Fruitmarket in Glasgow. Refu...
Jamie McGrigor (Highlands and Islands) (Con) Con
I am pleased to take part in today’s debate, and I want to say at the outset that I am proud of the UK’s long and distinguished record of offering asylum and...
Humza Yousaf SNP
Jamie McGrigor mentioned that he is pleased that the coalition Government took that step of not detaining children in Dungavel. What is his reaction when chi...
Jamie McGrigor Con
If that is really the case, I will have to come back to the minister at another time with an answer to that. All I know is that what I said is true. Dawn ra...
Alison McInnes (North East Scotland) (LD) LD
I, too, welcome the debate, which is fitting in refugee week. I have no doubt that, across the chamber, we want to see the asylum system constantly improvi...
Bob Doris (Glasgow) (SNP) SNP
I interject not on the subject of independence but on the responsibilities that the Scottish Government currently has. Housing would be a core responsibility...
Alison McInnes LD
I despair of the constant negativity from the SNP, which is always looking at what we cannot do instead of at what we can do. There is plenty of scope to imp...
Humza Yousaf SNP
I ask Alison McInnes the same question that I asked Jamie McGrigor. Does she have an opinion on whether Yarl’s Wood—later on, I plan to read a testimony that...
Alison McInnes LD
Wherever they come from, children ought not to be detained unless as a very last resort. We have seen a significant change in the whole procedure, and it is ...
Graeme Pearson (South Scotland) (Lab) Lab
In his opening speech, the minister alluded to the terror, the tragedy and the fear that are faced by many people who cross the globe to seek asylum in a for...
Dennis Robertson (Aberdeenshire West) (SNP) SNP
Does the member believe that the media have an important role to play in putting across factual information rather than the misinformation that, in some area...
Graeme Pearson Lab
I am grateful to Dennis Robertson for that intervention. I acknowledge the part that the media can play, but that only strengthens my argument that the Gover...
The Deputy Presiding Officer (John Scott) Con
We move to the open debate; speeches should be of five minutes or thereabouts, please. 15:52
Christina McKelvie (Hamilton, Larkhall and Stonehouse) (SNP) SNP
It is not often that we take part in a debate that has the words “asylum seekers and refugees” and “humane system” in the same sentence. I want to focus on t...
Sandra White (Glasgow Kelvin) (SNP) SNP
I, too, welcome refugee week Scotland and the events that are taking place across Scotland to mark it. I congratulate all at the Scottish Refugee Council on ...
Alison McInnes LD
Will the member take an intervention?
Sandra White SNP
I will finish my point and then take an intervention. Many groups and individuals have fought for many years to end that practice, but it has not ended.
Alison McInnes LD
I back the member’s remarks on the “go home” vans, but not her suggestion that they were anything to do with the Liberal Democrats. She knows that the scheme...
Sandra White SNP
I thank Alison McInnes, but she knows what they say, and if you get into bed with someone, you have to take the consequences. Her Liberal Democrat colleagues...
Margaret McCulloch (Central Scotland) (Lab) Lab
The debate about this country’s relationship with refugees and asylum seekers is too often distorted, too unfair and misleading, and many of the most common...
Bob Doris (Glasgow) (SNP) SNP
I am delighted to follow an excellent speech from Margaret McCulloch, in which she mentioned some of the common misconceptions with which I was going to begi...
Clare Adamson (Central Scotland) (SNP) SNP
I am often asked by some of the many young visitors to the Parliament what I think is the best thing the Parliament has delivered for the people of Scotland....
The Deputy Presiding Officer Con
I call Dr Elaine Murray. Members now have up to five minutes. 16:19
Elaine Murray (Dumfriesshire) (Lab) Lab
Following on from Clare Adamson’s speech, my tangential knowledge of the experience of a refugee relates to Hector Fuentes, who came to the UK in 1976 having...
Humza Yousaf SNP
I accept Dr Murray’s point about Jack McConnell and his sincerity in trying to change the situation. I have a great amount of respect for Mr McConnell. Howev...
Elaine Murray Lab
My argument is that we can achieve some of what we are talking about through devolution. I think that that is also Jack McConnell’s argument. As far as I can...
James Dornan (Glasgow Cathcart) (SNP) SNP
Glasgow, Scotland’s greatest city, is a city built on immigrants. Many folk from Ireland, Italy, the Indian subcontinent, countries across Africa, the rest o...
Dennis Robertson (Aberdeenshire West) (SNP) SNP
I associate myself with Margaret McCulloch, whose speech stuck to the facts and put in context the problem, which is sometimes overstated—perhaps not in the ...
The Deputy Presiding Officer Con
We move to closing speeches. I remind members who have taken part in the debate that they might wish to return to the chamber. 16:34