Chamber
Meeting of the Parliament 02 April 2015
02 Apr 2015 · S4 · Meeting of the Parliament
Item of business
Prisoners (Control of Release) (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1
What I said was my interpretation of what the Law Society said. As I was saying, it all comes down to implementation. If the Government has a problem with implementing the 2007 act, it is not fit for purpose. However, as Jayne Baxter said, we are not there yet and we have to move on. We learn from the past.
The Prisoners (Control of Release) (Scotland) Bill deals with the back end of our judicial system—the last few days, weeks and months before a prisoner is released. That is where we should start; it is the first step towards working on ending automatic early release for all prisoners. Alternatively, we might decide that the second step should be to deal with the front end of the judicial system, which is sentencing. I know that we have heard different views on that this afternoon but, let me be clear, the bill is not about that. We should use future bills to make sentencing more transparent and improve it.
I was surprised when Margaret Mitchell decided to dissent from the general principles of the bill, although I welcome the fact that the Scottish Conservatives will abstain today.
Our stage 1 report reflects the point that prisoners should be supported when they come out of prison, and that families of victims have the right to know that offenders should be assessed before they are released. That is what Victim Support Scotland said that it wanted. The bill is about public safety and I am looking forward to stage 2.
15:36In the same item of business
The Deputy Presiding Officer (Elaine Smith)
Lab
Good afternoon. The first item of business is a debate on motion S4M-12878, in the name of Michael Matheson, on the Prisoners (Control of Release) (Scotland)...
The Cabinet Secretary for Justice (Michael Matheson)
SNP
I begin by apologising for my late arrival, which was entirely my fault and responsibility. I welcome the opportunity to speak in this debate at stage 1 of ...
The Deputy Presiding Officer
Lab
I call Christine Grahame to speak on behalf of the Justice Committee. 14:46
Christine Grahame (Midlothian South, Tweeddale and Lauderdale) (SNP)
SNP
Thank you, Presiding Officer. I welcome the opportunity to speak in the debate and, as you say, I speak as the convener of the Justice Committee. I will spea...
Elaine Murray (Dumfriesshire) (Lab)
Lab
I thank the clerks and the witnesses for their efforts in bringing a lot of issues to the committee’s attention during the stage 1 process. The Scottish Nat...
Margaret Mitchell (Central Scotland) (Con)
Con
This stage 1 debate on the Prisoners (Control of Release) (Scotland) Bill is an important one. I thank the clerks, the convener and my fellow members of the ...
Christian Allard (North East Scotland) (SNP)
SNP
Will Margaret Mitchell take an intervention?
Margaret Mitchell
Con
If Mr Allard does not mind, I will make some progress. That is not a precedent that the Scottish Parliament should set or encourage, and nor is the cabinet ...
Nigel Don (Angus North and Mearns) (SNP)
SNP
I speak on the bill in my capacity as convener of the Delegated Powers and Law Reform Committee. Although the bill contains only one delegated power, the com...
Stewart Stevenson (Banffshire and Buchan Coast) (SNP)
SNP
Is it the committee’s view that that is not simply a matter in relation to this bill, but a principle that it wants to apply in similar circumstances in simi...
Nigel Don
SNP
Stewart Stevenson’s point is absolutely fair. As a member of the DPLR Committee, he will accept that that is our concern. We have tried to bring principled a...
Roderick Campbell (North East Fife) (SNP)
SNP
In historical terms, parole is quite recent, and the Parole Board for Scotland was set up only in 1968. Parole was subject to an important review by Lord Kin...
Jayne Baxter (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Lab)
Lab
There is little doubt that the criminal justice system in Scotland is in desperate need of reform. The aspect of that system that the bill seeks to address—s...
Christian Allard (North East Scotland) (SNP)
SNP
First, I would like to thank all the Justice Committee members and the organisations and individuals who came to give evidence. It was a long session and our...
Patricia Ferguson (Glasgow Maryhill and Springburn) (Lab)
Lab
I am sorry to interrupt the member, but my reading of what the Law Society said to members was not that the 2007 act was inadequate but that, if the bill was...
Christian Allard
SNP
What I said was my interpretation of what the Law Society said. As I was saying, it all comes down to implementation. If the Government has a problem with im...
Alison McInnes (North East Scotland) (LD)
LD
I apologise to members in advance, as I have a sore throat. If automatic early release for long-term prisoners is to be abolished, the alternative must pass...
Gil Paterson (Clydebank and Milngavie) (SNP)
SNP
I am pleased to take part in the debate as a member of the Justice Committee. The ending of automatic early release for prisoners is seen by a large cross-...
Margaret McDougall (West Scotland) (Lab)
Lab
As we have heard, the bill before us—which proposes to end automatic early release for sex offenders serving four years or more and other offenders serving 1...
Stewart Stevenson (Banffshire and Buchan Coast) (SNP)
SNP
I very much welcome the opportunity to speak on this important subject. We all know that control over the release of prisoners is a subject that has needed t...
Christina McKelvie (Hamilton, Larkhall and Stonehouse) (SNP)
SNP
I am not, and never have been, a member of the Justice Committee, but looking back over the eight years that I have spent in the Parliament and the debates o...
Patricia Ferguson (Glasgow Maryhill and Springburn) (Lab)
Lab
As an MSP who is not a member of the Justice Committee and is therefore not as familiar with the systems and processes that are involved in our application o...
Christine Grahame
SNP
Does the member accept that the Justice Committee will have the opportunity to take evidence on what might be substantial amendments at stage 2 if it wishes ...
Patricia Ferguson
Lab
I absolutely accept that, but it is still quite a strange way to legislate. The committee and Parliament should really have had those materials at stage 1 if...
Clare Adamson (Central Scotland) (SNP)
SNP
The decisions that we make as the bill goes through Parliament will affect our prison communities. A prison community is much more than the prisoners; the st...
John Finnie (Highlands and Islands) (Ind)
Ind
I, too, thank the many people who gave the evidence that formed the basis of the Justice Committee’s report. I will quote straight away from one of them, Pro...
Annabel Goldie (West Scotland) (Con)
Con
The debate has revealed a conundrum. People either support or oppose automatic early release. Those who support it want it; those who oppose it do not want i...
Christian Allard
SNP
Will the member give way?
Annabel Goldie
Con
Let me just expand my argument. As a political principle, my party’s credentials could not be clearer on the issue. In 2007, it was heartening to find that ...
Stewart Stevenson
SNP
Will the member take an intervention?