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Chamber

Meeting of the Parliament 18 March 2015

18 Mar 2015 · S4 · Meeting of the Parliament
Item of business
In-work Poverty

I am pleased to open our debate. The Scottish Green Party is campaigning for a £10 minimum wage for all by 2020, because no one should be expected to work for a wage that keeps them in poverty. That is the point of the debate; that is why we are campaigning.

During the referendum, we had plans for a more equal, jobs-rich and locally based economy, where work paid well. That principle is not divisive. I know that all MSPs agree that poverty is a bad thing, but do their parties’ plans add up to putting an end to in-work poverty?

The Greens’ £10 minimum wage will ensure that no one works for a wage that keeps them in poverty. We have for too long subsidised employers that pay poverty wages. Many of those employers are large multinationals that earn millions for shareholders, while their staff are paid poverty wages and kept off the breadline by public money. That corporate welfare must stop.

While the majority of children and working-age adults in relative poverty live in working households, at the other end of the pay scale, there are people earning millions of pounds. Chief executive officers in the FTSE 100 earn 400 times the average wage. Are those executives 400 times more entitled than the average worker? I do not think so. That inequality is profoundly damaging for society and wellbeing.

Ending poverty is inextricably linked to ending the vast gulf of inequality. Political scientist Susan George tells us to

“Study the rich ... not the poor”.

The Greens’ plans will link CEOs’ pay to the wellbeing of their lowest-paid employees. A maximum wage ratio for companies would mean that any rise in CEO pay required a rise for people on the lowest pay. That is only fair.

In the same item of business

The Deputy Presiding Officer (Elaine Smith) Lab
The next item of business is a debate on motion S4M-12678, in the name of Patrick Harvie, on an end to in-work poverty. 14:41
Alison Johnstone (Lothian) (Green) Green
I am pleased to open our debate. The Scottish Green Party is campaigning for a £10 minimum wage for all by 2020, because no one should be expected to work fo...
Nigel Don (Angus North and Mearns) (SNP) SNP
Does the member accept that many board directors can enhance their pay in many ways, including through share options and all sorts of other, unquantifiable t...
Alison Johnstone Green
That point is well made and should be taken into account. It means that directors’ wages are larger than they appear to be on their pay packet. The Greens w...
Neil Findlay (Lothian) (Lab) Lab
Would Alison Johnstone care to reflect on how full fiscal autonomy and the ripping out of £4 billion to £6 billion of public money would impact on her vision?
Alison Johnstone Green
It is fair to say that, as part of the United Kingdom—we find ourselves in that situation at the moment—we need a system that is fair and sustainable. The i...
The Deputy Presiding Officer Lab
Many thanks. I remind members who wish to participate that they should press their request-to-speak button. 14:51
The Cabinet Secretary for Fair Work, Skills and Training (Roseanna Cunningham) SNP
In the programme for government, we set out a range of cross-portfolio policies that were aimed at reducing inequality, including actions on fair work such a...
Neil Findlay Lab
One of the issues that I have raised with the minister before is the use of umbrella contracts. Last week, the Welsh Assembly issued a policy advice note on ...
Roseanna Cunningham SNP
We saw what the Welsh Government issued, and officials are currently looking at that very carefully. We are always open to the possibility that good practice...
The Deputy Presiding Officer Lab
I am afraid that you must draw to a close.
Roseanna Cunningham SNP
It is very important to engage across the board. It is clear that there is a great deal that can be done. By working together, we can have an impact. As a G...
The Deputy Presiding Officer Lab
I am afraid that we are tight for time this afternoon. 14:58
Neil Findlay (Lothian) (Lab) Lab
The low-pay and insecure job culture that we see at present is like a cancer in our society. It damages people. It eats away at their pride, relationships, m...
Annabel Goldie (West Scotland) (Con) Con
People who work hard for their families, try to put some money aside and make the right choices deserve reward and the security of a decent standard of livin...
Alison Johnstone Green
I have a constituent who was asked to be both at the jobcentre and at an interview for a training course at the same time, which resulted in him having his b...
Annabel Goldie Con
That is certainly illustrative of an element of very bad practice in the system. I do not dispute that, but that is not to say that the system as a whole is ...
Patrick Harvie (Glasgow) (Green) Green
Will the member give way?
Annabel Goldie Con
No. I am pushed for time. I am sorry. Of course it is right to challenge businesses, where they are able to do so, to pay their employees fairly. The living...
Chic Brodie (South Scotland) (SNP) SNP
Will the member take an intervention?
Annabel Goldie Con
I am sorry. I am pushed for time. The further increases announced by the chancellor today will mean even more money being kept by the earner. That is real h...
The Deputy Presiding Officer Lab
We turn to the open debate. I ask for speeches of four minutes, please. 15:09
Christine Grahame (Midlothian South, Tweeddale and Lauderdale) (SNP) SNP
I very much identify with the tenor of the independent and Green motion. It is ironic that we are having this debate on budget day. Members can call me cynic...
Alex Johnstone (North East Scotland) (Con) Con
Will Christine Grahame take an intervention?
Christine Grahame SNP
I am in the last 30 seconds of my speech. As for the Labour amendment, I have a lot in common with Neil Findlay’s sentiments, but Labour hitched itself to ...
Neil Findlay Lab
Full fiscal autonomy.
The Deputy Presiding Officer Lab
Order.
Christine Grahame SNP
Labour blocked that and kept the Tories in power.
Neil Findlay Lab
Four billion.
The Deputy Presiding Officer Lab
Order.