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Chamber

Meeting of the Parliament 17 March 2015

17 Mar 2015 · S4 · Meeting of the Parliament
Item of business
Scotland’s Place in Europe
Allard, Christian SNP North East Scotland Watch on SPTV

I start my contribution to this timely and important debate with a 1736 quote that is to be found in the diaries of a French minister, René de Voyer, who was the first person to use in writing the well-known expression, laissez-faire. He wrote, “Laissez-faire”—or let it be—

“should be the motto of all public powers, since the world was civilised ... That we cannot grow except by lowering our neighbours is a detestable notion! Only malice and malignity of heart is satisfied with such a principle and our national interest is opposed to it.”

That motto was also the essence of Adam Smith’s thinking—although he supported not an economy free from Government interference, but free trade between nations as a condition of the growth of those nations.

Laissez-faire is only half of the motto. The other half is laissez-passer—the right of free movement, not only of goods but, more important, of people, which is at the heart of the European project that is the EU.

I believe that we are where Adam Smith would have liked the people of Scotland to be—at the heart of Europe, free to trade and free to set up businesses and work across the EU. That is very much needed. As Dennis Robertson said to the minister in his intervention, it is important that small and medium-sized businesses are encouraged to work with the rest of the EU. Similarly, it is very important that our people are encouraged to live, work and participate all across the EU. It is important that we have not only the movement of goods, trade and businesses but the movement of people. It is how the EU is constructed.

I have found plenty of malice and malignity of heart in the debate about the European Union since I came to Britain. I was surprised about it. I find particularly detestable the notion that the UK cannot pursue its agenda to grow its own economy without rejoicing at its neighbours’ economic failings. That is something that we find often on television and the press, especially in the UK and London media.

Failings are many in the UK, just like in other EU countries and the EU is not perfect, as the minister said in his opening remarks. However, I assure members that the attitude of ridiculing other nations of the EU when they have problems has never been reciprocal. On the contrary, I have found that people across the EU have great respect for the UK—a respect that some politicians undermine here regularly. When I say “here”, of course I do not mean in this Parliament.

Former French Prime Minister Michel Rocard was one of the first voices to express worry about that. He made it clear that if the UK was so desperate to exit the EU, the EU might be better without the UK. The truth is that for us to do well, we need our neighbours to do well. Instead of blaming the EU for our Westminster Government’s shortcomings, we need our London-based politicians to change their tune. Our national interest, of the UK or Scotland, is in direct opposition to an exit from the EU—the so-called Brexit. In France, they call it Le Brexit, so famous is it.

The former head of the French Government made his views clear on that point. He said:

“British elites are afraid of the isolation that would result, that may weaken the City ... But the English bank is part paralyzing factors today, it is highly more speculative than others. It is a paralysis for real economy.”

That comment is the result of a constant attack on the EU. I do not know whether Michel Rocard agrees with the Scottish Government’s double-majority proposal, but he made it clear that the problem is political, in London, not even with the people of England and certainly not with the people of Scotland.

Given my many years working in the fishing industry, I understand maybe better than most that the EU is far from perfect—again, as the minister said in his opening remarks. However, I point out that other EU countries have been a lot more successful in negotiating at EU level than the UK has. For example, I welcome the Scottish Government proposal on fisheries. Yes, we should continue to move away from a centralised approach to fisheries management in favour of greater flexibility and the further delegation of powers to national and regional level. The member state should be granted further autonomy in relation to inshore waters to ensure the survival of Scottish fishermen’s traditional fishing grounds.

It is not only about fishing but agriculture and migration from outside the EU. The Justice Committee is taking evidence on the Human Trafficking and Exploitation (Scotland) Bill. The horrific stories that we have heard of migrants coming from outside the EU would be a lot worse if we were isolated and not part of the EU. The free movement of people is so important.

I finish with a quote from not Adam Smith, but his contemporary Voltaire. Adam Smith kept a bust of Voltaire in his home—members will not find one in my office—and Voltaire knew what Scotland’s place in Europe was when he said:

“We look to Scotland for all our ideas of civilisation”.

Scotland’s place in the EU is where we are today and it is what we all are. This EU migrant—this EU citizen—will vote for the Scottish Government’s motion.

15:10  

In the same item of business

The Presiding Officer (Tricia Marwick) NPA
The next item of business is a debate on motion S4M-12670, in the name of Humza Yousaf, on Scotland’s place in Europe. 14:21
The Minister for Europe and International Development (Humza Yousaf) SNP
Scotland has been a progressive and integral part of the European Union for the past 40 years. Engagement with the EU and its institutions is a core priority...
Liam McArthur (Orkney Islands) (LD) LD
The minister will be aware of the importance of structural funding to the region that I partly represent. At the back end of last year, there was some concer...
Humza Yousaf SNP
That is an issue that the member has raised previously, and I know that he has had reassurances from this Government. We share his concerns, and I am happy t...
John Mason (Glasgow Shettleston) (SNP) SNP
On the issue of TTIP, would the minister accept that we probably have more common ground with some of our European neighbours than we do with the London Gove...
Humza Yousaf SNP
I am doing my best to be as consensual as I can in the debate. The UK Government knows our position and that we are asking for a black-and-white exemption fo...
Dennis Robertson (Aberdeenshire West) (SNP) SNP
Does the minister agree that there is still more to be done within the domestic market to encourage small and medium-sized businesses to look at the potentia...
Humza Yousaf SNP
I agree entirely. Internationalisation is one of the four priorities of Scotland’s economic strategy, which the First Minister and Deputy First Minister laun...
The Deputy Presiding Officer (John Scott) Con
Will you draw to a close, please?
Humza Yousaf SNP
I will end on this point. We believe that there should be a double-majority system for that referendum. We believe that Scotland and indeed other parts of th...
Claire Baker (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Lab) Lab
I am pleased to be opening this debate for Labour. This is my first opening speech in this area of my portfolio. Previously, as a lead on rural affairs, food...
Stewart Stevenson (Banffshire and Buchan Coast) (SNP) SNP
Will the member take a brief intervention?
Claire Baker Lab
I ask the member to be brief as I am quite short of time.
Stewart Stevenson SNP
Does the member recall that, when the UK entered the European Union in 1973, most of the major broadcasting and print media organisations had correspondents ...
Claire Baker Lab
I am pleased to say that I do not have much recall of 1973, but the member makes a fair point. It is not just down to politicians. It is also down to our soc...
Humza Yousaf SNP
Will the member take an intervention?
Claire Baker Lab
I am in my final minute. Labour does not support a referendum as we know that it will cause uncertainty for business. A referendum is not in the interests o...
Jamie McGrigor (Highlands and Islands) (Con) Con
I welcome the debate as it gives me the chance to dispel the myths and scaremongering that are coming from members on the Government benches about Scotland’s...
Christian Allard (North East Scotland) (SNP) SNP
Will the member take an intervention?
Jamie McGrigor Con
I have only six minutes, so I want to make progress. The SNP asserts that Scotland has no appetite for a referendum on EU membership, despite the fact that ...
The Deputy Presiding Officer Con
Please draw to a close.
Jamie McGrigor Con
I am just going to close. For all those reasons and many more, the need for a referendum on EU membership will become more apparent in the next two years, d...
The Deputy Presiding Officer Con
We move to the open debate, with speeches of six minutes or thereby. 14:53
Christina McKelvie (Hamilton, Larkhall and Stonehouse) (SNP) SNP
In the past four years, as convener of the European and External Relations Committee, I have learned a lot about Europe, including a lot about its strengths....
Anne McTaggart (Glasgow) (Lab) Lab
I am pleased to contribute to this debate and to speak in support of Claire Baker’s amendment. At a time when countries are fighting for their right to be p...
Christian Allard (North East Scotland) (SNP) SNP
I start my contribution to this timely and important debate with a 1736 quote that is to be found in the diaries of a French minister, René de Voyer, who was...
Liam McArthur (Orkney Islands) (LD) LD
I welcome the debate and I thank Humza Yousaf—or, as I like to call him, the minister—for allowing Parliament this opportunity. The motion and the amendment...
Christian Allard SNP
Will Liam McArthur take an intervention?
Liam McArthur LD
No, thank you. It is too easy to link the SNP’s calls for a retreat from the UK to UKIP’s and the Tories’ calls for a retreat from Europe. There is a remark...
Stewart Maxwell (West Scotland) (SNP) SNP
Scotland is often described as being on the periphery of Europe. Although that may be true in a geographic sense, our strong cultural, historical and politic...