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Chamber

Meeting of the Parliament 19 February 2015

19 Feb 2015 · S4 · Meeting of the Parliament
Item of business
National Marine Plan

Five years ago, we passed a hugely ambitious marine act. The marine plan, which follows it five years on, is crucial.

As other members have said, the plan is a decision-making framework. The document must remain up to date and reflect national priorities and policy; it must also provide the basis for regional and local decision making. That is the context in which the RACCE Committee felt that the draft plan is not fit for purpose. As many have said, the plan is overprescriptive in some areas, but too vague in others. Rob Gibson ably set out the committee’s concerns in that regard.

I very much welcome the fact that the cabinet secretary has accepted our amendment. We wanted not to delete but to move on and add to the Government’s motion, in particular to reflect the excellent representations that were received in evidence to the committee. It also enables us to flag up a couple of issues that were not covered in the motion.

The debate has been a good one, reflecting the quality of the advance briefings that we all received. Those have been extremely helpful.

Through our amendment, we wanted to flag up the central issue of the health of Scotland’s seas and the importance of enhancement, recovery and protection. We wanted to note the concerns expressed by the don’t take the P out of MPAs campaign and, in particular, to recognise the significant challenges posed in progressing delivery of the plan and ensuring capacity not only at the regional level, in the new regional partnerships, but in our local authorities to monitor and assess developments and to consider the potential cumulative and interconnected impacts of new development.

We recognise the importance of the national marine plan interactive in making sure that the national and regional marine plans are living documents. Our overarching objective must be sustainable development and recognition of its three legs: environmental, social and economic interests. The crucial issue for the marine environment is not just to look at how things are now, but to think to the future, in particular about climate change adaptation and mitigation.

A key issue that has been stressed is the capacity, resourcing and expertise to make the decisions that will be needed, following on from the marine plan. How will the regional marine and spatial planning partnerships be able to progress those parts of the national marine plan that we in the committee think are vague?

The idea of sharing Marine Scotland’s expertise and science is crucial. I observe in relation to renewables, for example, that the time lag for local authorities to gain expertise in onshore marine was years, and extra investment was needed from ministers. A huge amount of catch-up will be needed, because marine technologies are changing all the time; so is the science and the knowledge about the impact on our wildlife. Therefore, we have a challenge in front of us. It is crucial that we get the balance right, whether in relation to fishing, aquaculture, oil and gas, renewables, transport, the leisure industries or nature interpretation. The interplay among all those different uses will be judged and decided not just by what is in the plan, but by how the regional partnerships and our local authorities get involved.

That is why the science base that Tavish Scott mentioned is so important. Science will not make the decisions for us but it will at least let us weigh up the choices and make more informed decisions.

The precautionary principle, which Rob Gibson mentioned, is crucial. If we are not sure, we can always come back to an issue, but we must ensure that we do not make things worse.

Some important issues were raised in the briefing from Scottish Renewables, which is concerned that there should not be ad hoc, year-on-year changes to the national marine plan. I understand that concern—it is a concern about stability, which was raised by Tavish Scott, too. However, given the pace and scale of change in the marine environment and the industries that are active in it, the committee felt quite strongly that we need to revisit the marine plan, not just in five years but perhaps in three.

RSPB Scotland made an important point about the fact that national policies must be implemented within safe environmental limits and be supported by robust environmental assessment. The RSPB’s concern is that the lack of an overall assessment of the plan compromises the potential of the plan to deliver.

Environmental assessment of every protected area in the marine environment is more important than ever. If we are to achieve

“Clean, healthy, safe, productive and diverse seas”,

if they are to be

“managed to meet the long-term needs of nature and people”

and if we are to live within environmental limits, we need the knowledge base. That is a key issue because it is about the relationship between what we need as a society and what many of our most fragile rural communities need to keep living and growing. It also affects the long-term capacity of our marine environment to be exploited to deliver jobs and economic benefits. That is why the committee wanted to flag the concerns of the don’t take the P out of MPAs campaign.

I echo the comments from Claudia Beamish and Rob Gibson about the need for conflict resolution. In fact, conflict resolution was mentioned by everybody who talked about the local issues and is a crucial issue for us to focus on. Graeme Dey, Margaret McDougall and Elaine Murray also raised the issue. We need to draw on the expertise and experience that are already there. The work that has been done in Shetland and Clyde is important—we need to draw that in.

However, we cannot wait until those pilots are complete before we take decisions. Because of the length of time that it has taken to get to the marine plan, there are decisions that need to be taken throughout the country. That makes the experience of volunteers, local organisations and marine planning partnerships hugely important now and not just in future.

Margaret McDougall referred to the work that has been done by COAST. In its submission to the Clyde marine protection area, it touches on some of the win-wins that Dave Thompson talked about. When we have sustainable fisheries and local involvement, and when we try to bring together the interests of sustainable fisheries, recreational sea angling, tourism, leisure and other sustainable developments, there are potential win-wins. The research that COAST highlighted in its submission talks about the economic benefits that come from making the most of small-scale but cumulatively important developments.

The same point was made by Jean Urquhart, when she asked how we can ensure that those opportunities are delivered properly. She made an important point about policing of the process and of what people are doing. We need to be confident that what people aspire to do is what happens in practice.

Elaine Murray made an important point about drawing on the expertise across boundaries. I want to finish on that issue. A huge amount of expertise is there already—we need to learn from that. If there is one thing that we need to take forward, it is the knowledge and information that are already there. The real challenge is to ensure that those who will be responsible for marine planning have that knowledge and expertise at their fingertips because, in the end, that will be the measure of whether the process is successful.

15:34  

In the same item of business

The Deputy Presiding Officer (Elaine Smith) Lab
The first item of business this afternoon is a debate on motion S4M-12343, in the name of Richard Lochhead, on the national marine plan.
The Cabinet Secretary for Rural Affairs, Food and Environment (Richard Lochhead) SNP
I am pleased that we are able to debate Scotland’s first national marine plan, and I begin by thanking the stakeholders who have played an important part in ...
Stewart Stevenson (Banffshire and Buchan Coast) (SNP) SNP
Is the minister aware of the concerns that many of the fishermen whom I represent have when they see, beyond the 12-mile limit in particular, fishing boats f...
Richard Lochhead SNP
Unfortunately, the marine plan does not usurp the common fisheries policy. However, it is certainly the Scottish Government’s policy position to pursue a lev...
Tavish Scott (Shetland Islands) (LD) LD
On the minister’s point about development, has he come to a considered view on the burying of sea-bed cables, given that the fibre optic cable between Faroe,...
Richard Lochhead SNP
As the marine plan lays out, and as was discussed with the Rural Affairs, Climate Change and Environment Committee, although we are willing to review the wor...
Claudia Beamish (South Scotland) (Lab) Lab
Scottish Labour values the opportunity for additional scrutiny that this debate on the draft national marine plan brings. As the cabinet secretary has highl...
Alex Fergusson (Galloway and West Dumfries) (Con) Con
No one from the Conservative Party or, I am sure, from any other party, would argue with the overall statement in the motion that “the general policies in t...
Rob Gibson (Caithness, Sutherland and Ross) (SNP) SNP
The scrutiny of the national marine plan has raised quite a lot of criticisms from our committee. They are intended to say not, “This is not fit for purpose”...
Margaret McDougall (West Scotland) (Lab) Lab
I welcome the opportunity to speak in this debate on our national marine plan. The plan has been drafted to be consistent with the UK marine policy statement...
The Deputy Presiding Officer Lab
We have a little bit of time in hand if members wish to take interventions. 14:42
Graeme Dey (Angus South) (SNP) SNP
Pivotal to successful delivery of the marine plan in both the national and local contexts will be the points that are covered in paragraph 43 of the Rural Af...
Claudia Beamish Lab
It is possible that, if the marine plan had not been delayed so much—I understand the reasons for that delay—we would not be in the situation that we are now...
Graeme Dey SNP
That is one point of view, but the fact is that a significant series of critical offshore developments are under threat because of that. Appropriate experti...
Tavish Scott (Shetland Islands) (LD) LD
I start by agreeing with Graeme Dey’s point about the RNLI’s expertise. I absolutely share that view regarding the expertise in Lerwick and Aith in my consti...
Dave Thompson (Skye, Lochaber and Badenoch) (SNP) SNP
I, too, welcome the principle of the Scottish Government adopting a national marine plan to provide guidance to decision makers and users of Scotland’s marin...
The Deputy Presiding Officer Lab
Mr Thompson, can you move your microphone slightly more towards you? We are having difficulty in hearing you. Thank you.
Dave Thompson SNP
I could shout, but I had better not. I take it that the volume is better now, Presiding Officer. I will start again so that you can hear the whole thrust of ...
Elaine Murray (Dumfriesshire) (Lab) Lab
I apologise to the cabinet secretary for not being present for the beginning of his speech, but I am a member of the Justice Sub-Committee on Policing, which...
Michael Russell (Argyll and Bute) (SNP) SNP
I am glad that the cabinet secretary has, at the very outset, drawn attention to the on-going difficulty in the Sound of Mull with the Lysblink Seaway, which...
Jean Urquhart (Highlands and Islands) (Ind) Ind
I, too, welcome the national marine plan as a positive step towards effective marine spatial planning of the Scottish sea area. I acknowledge that, although ...
Jamie McGrigor (Highlands and Islands) (Con) Con
I am pleased to close this important debate for the Scottish Conservatives. We have had some good and positive contributions from many members. As Alex Ferg...
Rob Gibson SNP
What species does Jamie McGrigor think should be farmed on the north and east coasts of Scotland?
Jamie McGrigor Con
I think that the industry is talking about farmed salmon. My constituents in Islay and Jura have expressed many concerns to me about the unacceptable delays...
Sarah Boyack (Lothian) (Lab) Lab
Five years ago, we passed a hugely ambitious marine act. The marine plan, which follows it five years on, is crucial. As other members have said, the plan i...
Richard Lochhead SNP
I thank all members across the chamber for their contributions to the debate on Scotland’s first national marine plan, which has been many years in the makin...
Claudia Beamish Lab
Does the cabinet secretary agree that enhancement is vital because some areas are denuded? Recovery is not enough for our marine environment, and that is hig...
Richard Lochhead SNP
As Claudia Beamish knows, our approach is to encourage enhancement of the marine environment when possible, but we have to respect existing activities. Unles...
Sarah Boyack Lab
One of the concerns that has been flagged up to us is about the detail of MPAs and the balance between protection and sustainable fisheries. Will the cabinet...
Richard Lochhead SNP
As I have indicated previously, I am happy to look at that. If I have time, I just want to raise an issue that other members have mentioned. We need to en...