Chamber
Meeting of the Parliament 28 January 2015
28 Jan 2015 · S4 · Meeting of the Parliament
Item of business
Women Offenders
I congratulate Kezia Dugdale on what was basically a broadly drawn and generally well-argued case. I agree on the broad thrust and disagree on the detail—that is the nature of debate. I was slightly disappointed that the issue of remand did not come until 12 minutes into her 14-minute speech, but Elaine Murray dealt with the matter; I very much welcome that.
Like others, I have visited the 218 centre. It was probably more than 10 years ago when I went there with Pauline McNeill, who was a Labour MSP at the time, thus indicating a willingness and an ability to work together. At the risk of damaging Richard Simpson’s political career forever, I add that we worked together very effectively when we were dealing with the issue of Peterhead prison. I used to take him away from his officials for secret coffee rendezvous. He is covering his face—but not in shame, because he did well on the subject. We can work together on the issue of women offenders and I very much welcome the tone of the debate so far.
An issue that has not come up might usefully be added for consideration afterwards. It is very clear that there are huge literacy and numeracy issues in prison. I genuinely do not know whether that is a gender issue. However, in smaller units, which is where we would expect to see women, there ought to be greater opportunity for dealing with that issue.
In the same item of business
The Deputy Presiding Officer (Elaine Smith)
Lab
The next item of business is a debate on motion S4M-12160, in the name of Kezia Dugdale, on women offenders. I call Kezia Dugdale to speak to and move the mo...
Kezia Dugdale (Lothian) (Lab)
Lab
I welcome the opportunity to devote Labour business time to female offending. It is to our collective shame that the female population of our prisons has dou...
Stewart Stevenson (Banffshire and Buchan Coast) (SNP)
SNP
I am very much in tune with what Kezia Dugdale is saying. A Soroptimist International report that came out recently says that 80 per cent of women offenders ...
Kezia Dugdale
Lab
I absolutely concur with that. Several Labour members will touch on mental health. I would have more sympathy with Stewart Stevenson’s position, however, if ...
The Cabinet Secretary for Justice (Michael Matheson)
SNP
Members are aware that I announced on Monday that the Scottish Prison Service’s plan for a women’s prison in Inverclyde will not go ahead because the plan do...
Kezia Dugdale
Lab
I welcome the cabinet secretary’s remarks on evaluation. Can he tell us, in response to the question that I asked in my opening speech, whether he has examin...
The Deputy Presiding Officer
Lab
Cabinet secretary—you are approaching your last 30 seconds.
Michael Matheson
SNP
My officials are engaged in work on those projects. When the projects received funding two years ago, part of the agreement concerned their sustainability an...
Margaret Mitchell (Central Scotland) (Con)
Con
I congratulate Labour on bringing the issue of women offenders to the chamber. I am sympathetic to the intent behind the motion, but it misses the mark with ...
Alison McInnes (North East Scotland) (LD)
LD
I am so pleased that the Cabinet Secretary for Justice has reflected on the plan for HMP Inverclyde and listened to the progressive voices that were raised a...
The Deputy Presiding Officer
Lab
We move to the open debate. We do not have a lot of time available, so I ask members to keep to speeches of six minutes. 15:48
Roderick Campbell (North East Fife) (SNP)
SNP
Like others, I welcomed the cabinet secretary’s statement on Monday. I also welcomed his considered response to the Justice Committee on 16 December. Members...
Elaine Murray (Dumfriesshire) (Lab)
Lab
Like other members and the organisations that have campaigned for a rethink on the proposed female prison at Inverclyde, I welcome the cabinet secretary’s st...
Christine Grahame (Midlothian South, Tweeddale and Lauderdale) (SNP)
SNP
I commend Alison McInnes, not just for her very measured and thoughtful speech, but because she has single-handedly kept the focus on the delivery of the rec...
Margaret Mitchell
Con
Is the point not that the facility that was proposed was not in line with Elish Angiolini’s recommendations, which had been fully debated? It had been identi...
Christine Grahame
SNP
None of us on the committee thought that what was proposed was perfect, but I do not recall anyone opposing it aggressively. We had huge reservations about l...
Mary Fee (West Scotland) (Lab)
Lab
I congratulate the cabinet secretary on taking the decision not to go ahead with the proposed women’s prison in Inverclyde. We need a radical change in how w...
Roderick Campbell
SNP
The member may recall that Dame Elish Angiolini, in giving evidence on child impact assessments, said: “I do not believe that any judge who sentenced withou...
Mary Fee
Lab
I take on board that point. However, I am trying to make the point that the child and family impact assessment should be at the front and centre of decision ...
Stewart Stevenson (Banffshire and Buchan Coast) (SNP)
SNP
I congratulate Kezia Dugdale on what was basically a broadly drawn and generally well-argued case. I agree on the broad thrust and disagree on the detail—tha...
Dr Richard Simpson (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Lab)
Lab
I have a couple of facts to share. The previous numeracy survey, which was carried out in 2013, says that 22 per cent of women had numeracy problems, 11 per ...
Stewart Stevenson
SNP
I am grateful to the member for that. I am more familiar with the circumstances of male prisoners, because the sex offenders unit used to be in my constituen...
Christina McKelvie (Hamilton, Larkhall and Stonehouse) (SNP)
SNP
A famous female offender said: “Who were the women who, day by day, trod the very stones on which my feet now stood ... ? How and why had they broken the la...
Jayne Baxter (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Lab)
Lab
When the Angiolini report was published, the then justice secretary, Kenny MacAskill, called it a “compelling vision for the future.” The centrepiece of th...
Christina McKelvie
SNP
Like me, the member will know that three quarters of the women who are sent to jail receive sentences of six months or less. In 2008, the McLeish commission ...
Jayne Baxter
Lab
Yes, to put it briefly. Statistics show that 70 per cent of women offenders who receive a prison sentence of three months or less are reconvicted of an offe...
The Deputy Presiding Officer (John Scott)
Con
You should draw to a close, please.
Jayne Baxter
Lab
On a related topic, the Scottish sentencing council is an important development. It will provide an opportunity for a wider range of voices to be heard in th...
Gil Paterson (Clydebank and Milngavie) (SNP)
SNP
I am pleased to speak in this debate on women offenders and how we can best deal with that problem. This is my first speech as a member of the Justice Commit...
Dr Richard Simpson (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Lab)
Lab
I begin as I do in almost all the speeches that I make in the chamber by praising the Government for the things that it is doing right, in particular the cou...