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Chamber

Meeting of the Parliament 28 January 2015

28 Jan 2015 · S4 · Meeting of the Parliament
Item of business
Women Offenders

I absolutely concur with that. Several Labour members will touch on mental health. I would have more sympathy with Stewart Stevenson’s position, however, if his own Government had not cut research funding for mental health within the past few days. He is right to focus on mental health, but other mentoring projects exist, and the future of their funding is particularly pertinent for organisations such as Barnardo’s.

That brings me on to children. Two thirds of the women in our prisons have kids—at least, we think that is what the numbers are. We do not have exact figures because, understandably, women are not particularly keen to disclose, given the impact that that can have. We know that for the children of men who have been jailed there is a 95 per cent chance that they will go on to live with their mum. However, just 17 per cent of kids whose mum is jailed go on to live with their father, which means that there is a much higher propensity for children to end up in care when their mother is jailed. That should concern us all.

Barnardo’s runs a project at Cornton Vale that works with young women offenders under the age of 21. Not a single one of the mums currently has custody of her children. Just one third of the women who access another project that is operated by Barnardo’s—it mentors women who have experience of the criminal justice system—have custody of their kids.

Parliament has done great work on care leavers during this session, and we should be proud of that. Labour members were certainly proud to support the Government on the Children and Young People (Scotland) Bill, but we must follow that through and focus on the needs of looked-after children all along the way.

The Angiolini report tells us that more children in Scotland are affected by parental imprisonment than are affected by divorce, and that up to 30 per cent of those children will go on to develop mental health problems in their lifetimes.

We need services that are focused on tackling the deep-rooted issues of poverty and inequality, and we need them now. We need to break the care-leaver trajectory that says that a looked-after child is far more likely to go to jail than they are to go to university. That, too, should concern us all.

Later in the debate, members will hear from my colleague Elaine Murray, who will focus on the particular issues that affect women who are on remand. I spoke at the 218 project to a woman who had been on remand for eight weeks. During that time, she lost custody of her children: it took her three years to get those children back. That was a consequence of an eight-week stint on remand.

My colleague Jayne Baxter will focus on community justice centres, in particular in Fife. Mary Fee will talk about families that are affected by imprisonment and the work that the cross-party group that she chairs has done in that regard.

My colleague Richard Simpson will come on to Labour’s record. It was particularly unfortunate to see a tweet over the past few days from Christina McKelvie, I think, which asked what Labour had ever done on this issue. We will hear more about that in the course of the afternoon. When in office, Labour did a tremendous amount of work on this issue—Richard Simpson and Hugh Henry both served Parliament in the role of Deputy Minister for Justice. They set up drug treatment and testing order courts. I spent an entire day at one with Dr Oliver Aldridge, who is a consultant psychiatrist and world-leading expert on these issues. Hugh Henry and Richard Simpson are also responsible for the 218 project’s inception.

In the past few weeks, I have said that Parliament is at a crossroads on female offending. We were about to spend £75 million on the wrong thing while funding for the thing that works was about to run out. Half that problem has been solved with the justice secretary’s U-turn this week, which we very much welcome, but the picture is not yet complete.

Once again, I congratulate all the organisations that have been campaigning and I emphasise the need for cross-party support in the future. I look forward to today’s debate.

I move,

That the Parliament welcomes the decision of the Scottish Government to abandon its previously published plans for a large-scale women’s prison; congratulates the coalition of views that helped to bring about this decision; believes that the report produced by the Commission on Women Offenders led by Dame Elish Angiolini provides a clear roadmap for a different approach to women offending; believes that adequate and sustained funding is needed for community-based alternatives to imprisonment, and calls for full cross-party and wider stakeholder support and engagement in the debate and delivery of the commission’s recommendations.

15:25  

In the same item of business

The Deputy Presiding Officer (Elaine Smith) Lab
The next item of business is a debate on motion S4M-12160, in the name of Kezia Dugdale, on women offenders. I call Kezia Dugdale to speak to and move the mo...
Kezia Dugdale (Lothian) (Lab) Lab
I welcome the opportunity to devote Labour business time to female offending. It is to our collective shame that the female population of our prisons has dou...
Stewart Stevenson (Banffshire and Buchan Coast) (SNP) SNP
I am very much in tune with what Kezia Dugdale is saying. A Soroptimist International report that came out recently says that 80 per cent of women offenders ...
Kezia Dugdale Lab
I absolutely concur with that. Several Labour members will touch on mental health. I would have more sympathy with Stewart Stevenson’s position, however, if ...
The Cabinet Secretary for Justice (Michael Matheson) SNP
Members are aware that I announced on Monday that the Scottish Prison Service’s plan for a women’s prison in Inverclyde will not go ahead because the plan do...
Kezia Dugdale Lab
I welcome the cabinet secretary’s remarks on evaluation. Can he tell us, in response to the question that I asked in my opening speech, whether he has examin...
The Deputy Presiding Officer Lab
Cabinet secretary—you are approaching your last 30 seconds.
Michael Matheson SNP
My officials are engaged in work on those projects. When the projects received funding two years ago, part of the agreement concerned their sustainability an...
Margaret Mitchell (Central Scotland) (Con) Con
I congratulate Labour on bringing the issue of women offenders to the chamber. I am sympathetic to the intent behind the motion, but it misses the mark with ...
Alison McInnes (North East Scotland) (LD) LD
I am so pleased that the Cabinet Secretary for Justice has reflected on the plan for HMP Inverclyde and listened to the progressive voices that were raised a...
The Deputy Presiding Officer Lab
We move to the open debate. We do not have a lot of time available, so I ask members to keep to speeches of six minutes. 15:48
Roderick Campbell (North East Fife) (SNP) SNP
Like others, I welcomed the cabinet secretary’s statement on Monday. I also welcomed his considered response to the Justice Committee on 16 December. Members...
Elaine Murray (Dumfriesshire) (Lab) Lab
Like other members and the organisations that have campaigned for a rethink on the proposed female prison at Inverclyde, I welcome the cabinet secretary’s st...
Christine Grahame (Midlothian South, Tweeddale and Lauderdale) (SNP) SNP
I commend Alison McInnes, not just for her very measured and thoughtful speech, but because she has single-handedly kept the focus on the delivery of the rec...
Margaret Mitchell Con
Is the point not that the facility that was proposed was not in line with Elish Angiolini’s recommendations, which had been fully debated? It had been identi...
Christine Grahame SNP
None of us on the committee thought that what was proposed was perfect, but I do not recall anyone opposing it aggressively. We had huge reservations about l...
Mary Fee (West Scotland) (Lab) Lab
I congratulate the cabinet secretary on taking the decision not to go ahead with the proposed women’s prison in Inverclyde. We need a radical change in how w...
Roderick Campbell SNP
The member may recall that Dame Elish Angiolini, in giving evidence on child impact assessments, said: “I do not believe that any judge who sentenced withou...
Mary Fee Lab
I take on board that point. However, I am trying to make the point that the child and family impact assessment should be at the front and centre of decision ...
Stewart Stevenson (Banffshire and Buchan Coast) (SNP) SNP
I congratulate Kezia Dugdale on what was basically a broadly drawn and generally well-argued case. I agree on the broad thrust and disagree on the detail—tha...
Dr Richard Simpson (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Lab) Lab
I have a couple of facts to share. The previous numeracy survey, which was carried out in 2013, says that 22 per cent of women had numeracy problems, 11 per ...
Stewart Stevenson SNP
I am grateful to the member for that. I am more familiar with the circumstances of male prisoners, because the sex offenders unit used to be in my constituen...
Christina McKelvie (Hamilton, Larkhall and Stonehouse) (SNP) SNP
A famous female offender said: “Who were the women who, day by day, trod the very stones on which my feet now stood ... ? How and why had they broken the la...
Jayne Baxter (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Lab) Lab
When the Angiolini report was published, the then justice secretary, Kenny MacAskill, called it a “compelling vision for the future.” The centrepiece of th...
Christina McKelvie SNP
Like me, the member will know that three quarters of the women who are sent to jail receive sentences of six months or less. In 2008, the McLeish commission ...
Jayne Baxter Lab
Yes, to put it briefly. Statistics show that 70 per cent of women offenders who receive a prison sentence of three months or less are reconvicted of an offe...
The Deputy Presiding Officer (John Scott) Con
You should draw to a close, please.
Jayne Baxter Lab
On a related topic, the Scottish sentencing council is an important development. It will provide an opportunity for a wider range of voices to be heard in th...
Gil Paterson (Clydebank and Milngavie) (SNP) SNP
I am pleased to speak in this debate on women offenders and how we can best deal with that problem. This is my first speech as a member of the Justice Commit...
Dr Richard Simpson (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Lab) Lab
I begin as I do in almost all the speeches that I make in the chamber by praising the Government for the things that it is doing right, in particular the cou...