Hansard

The Deputy Presiding Officer (John Scott) Con

The next item of business is a debate on motion S4M-09740, in the name of James Kelly, on the living wage. 15:51

James Kelly (Rutherglen) (Lab) Lab

I welcome the opportunity to open, on behalf of the Labour Party, this afternoon’s debate on the living wage, because it is an important debate that is not a...

Chic Brodie (South Scotland) (SNP) SNP

Will James Kelly take an intervention?

James Kelly Lab

Let me get started. The suggestion would make a real difference now to the economy, to jobs and to the pay of working people, and there is no doubt that it ...

Kevin Stewart (Aberdeen Central) (SNP) SNP

Will Mr Kelly give way?

James Kelly Lab

I will take Chic Brodie first.

Chic Brodie SNP

I will set all this in context. I understand James Kelly’s rationale and the feelings behind his motion, but how does he react to the fact that yesterday, in...

The Deputy Presiding Officer Con

Thank you.

Chic Brodie SNP

—to Renfrewshire, West Lothian and Inverclyde.

The Deputy Presiding Officer Con

Thank you. That will do.

James Kelly Lab

Well read, Mr Brodie—you got all the way through that. I will deal specifically with the legal points, including that one, later in my speech. Let us not hid...

John Mason (Glasgow Shettleston) (SNP) SNP

Will the member give way?

James Kelly Lab

I will give way to John Mason, who is one of the MSPs who was photographed.

John Mason SNP

I absolutely was photographed. Does James Kelly accept that the living wage will not apply to some people in the private sector and that only by raising the...

James Kelly Lab

What about trying to apply the living wage to the workers in the national museum of Scotland shop? What about trying to apply it to the cleaners in the Scott...

Willie Rennie (Mid Scotland and Fife) (LD) LD

Does James Kelly agree with our amendment or does he not? I thought that Labour Party policy was to raise tax thresholds.

James Kelly Lab

Mr Rennie needs to look at the Government’s overall programme; the Government of which his party is a member has been more interested in handing out tax cuts...

Kevin Stewart SNP

Will James Kelly give way?

James Kelly Lab

Let me make the point. I refer members to the briefing that the Scottish living wage campaign provided for the debate, and specifically to what Professor Chr...

Kevin Stewart SNP

Mr Kelly has talked about legal advice. There is case law on the issue—Rüffert v Land Niedersachsen—which I have mentioned to Mr Kelly before. How does he th...

James Kelly Lab

Never mind the case law—I will give practical examples. What about the care contracts at Renfrewshire Council, which is paying the living wage? What about th...

The Deputy First Minister and Cabinet Secretary for Infrastructure, Investment and Cities (Nicola Sturgeon) SNP

I welcome to the gallery members of staff from the national museum of Scotland. I am not going to use them as a political football. However, it will be of in...

Gavin Brown (Lothian) (Con) Con

Will the Deputy First Minister take an intervention?

Nicola Sturgeon SNP

I will not, just now. We cannot ignore the prevailing position simply because we do not agree with it. Equally, we are not prepared to do nothing, so we hav...

James Kelly Lab

Will the Deputy First Minister take an intervention?

Nicola Sturgeon SNP

I will not, just now. Part of the evaluation would be about pay and benefit. That was made implicit at stage 2. However, to make it more explicit, I confirm...

Jenny Marra (North East Scotland) (Lab) Lab

Will the Deputy First Minister take an intervention?

The Deputy Presiding Officer Con

The Deputy First Minister is in her last minute.

Nicola Sturgeon SNP

The amendments will strengthen the bill and help to ensure that payment of the living wage gets the priority that it deserves. Crucially, they will do so wit...

The Deputy Presiding Officer Con

Can we have some order, please?