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Chamber

Meeting of the Parliament 21 May 2014

21 May 2014 · S4 · Meeting of the Parliament
Item of business
Courts Reform (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

I refer members to my entry in the register of interests as a member of the Faculty of Advocates.

There is, as the convener of the Justice Committee suggested, no disagreement about the greater part of the bill. We need a court system that is fit for purpose, given that, as the court review concluded in 2007, the current system is “slow, inefficient and expensive”. Some of the proposed changes, such as sheriff specialisms and the introduction of summary sheriffs, carry wide support. The facility to hear generally routine matters at an appropriate level, and the freeing up of sheriffs from the less serious criminal workload seems to be sensible.

It is proposed that summary sheriffs would take up to 10 years to be fully established, and we heard evidence that they would offer flexibility. I am sure that there would be variation throughout Scotland in how they would operate, particularly in more remote areas.

The use of technology provides opportunities to reduce expense and the time that is spent on the court process substantially, and must be at the forefront of any court reform, together with procedural rule changes that encourage case management.

Although more work will be passed to summary sheriffs, sheriff courts will, in turn, receive work that is currently heard in the Court of Session. I was struck, however, by the agreement that that could not be delivered by sheriff courts operating as they do at present. Across the board, from the Lord President down, we heard concerns about the expense and inefficiency that comes not only from criminal work taking precedence in sheriff courts, but from the routine frustration of civil cases being heard over many diets and not being resolved at one sitting. Some of the concerns that were expressed on a change in the privative jurisdiction seemed to be based on that experience.

With regard to the proposed specialist personal injury court, my impression is that it would be welcomed—provided that it was properly resourced. It would need to replicate the best features of the current chapter 43 procedure in the Court of Session. If it could do so more economically than it, so much the better.

The committee was right to express its reservations on the proposed change to the privative jurisdiction. In particular, on the proposed change for non-personal injury cases, paragraph 98 of the financial memorandum suggests that the savings to the public purse will be “marginal”. We also have no information on the geographic spread of approximately 700 cases that will be transferred to the sheriff court on that basis; that matter is not specifically dealt with in the Gill review.

By common consent, the commercial procedure in the Court of Session works well. Sheriff Principal Taylor made the point in evidence that Glasgow sheriff court deals competently with commercial cases whose value exceeds £150,000. I am sure that that is true, but the proposed changes will not affect that. What they will do, in the absence of a national commercial court like the proposed specialist PI court, is prevent people in Wick or Stranraer with cases of a monetary value of less than £150,000 from having the option of having their case heard in Edinburgh, unless it is deemed to fall under the conditions of the test for remit. I am pleased by the Government’s comments on remit. In addition, as the Lord President said in oral evidence, some oversight by the court of session of decisions on remit might be not inappropriate.

With regard to the sheriff appeal court, the committee’s report says it all. On judicial review, the bill proposes quite substantial changes, and it is certainly sensible to have some time limit for bringing a petition, even if many of our witnesses thought that three months was too short. We should bear in mind that judicial review is comparatively rare, particularly outside immigration and asylum cases, so at any preliminary hearing for leave to bring a petition, the test should not be set too narrowly.

Finally, the elephant in the room is the question of sanction for counsel. I accept the need to curb disproportionate costs, and I welcome Sheriff Taylor’s proposed revised test. I heard the cabinet secretary’s comments to the committee on the history of the Faculty of Advocate’s comments on previous reforms, and I understand and largely share his view. Nevertheless I remain concerned that current proposals may well be to the detriment of the junior bar. The net result may simply be to encourage the already substantial growth of larger firms of solicitors at the expense of the bar, which may not necessarily represent best value for court users in the long term.

17:04

In the same item of business

The Presiding Officer (Tricia Marwick) NPA
The next item of business is a debate on motion S4M-10090, in the name of Roseanna Cunningham, on the Courts Reform (Scotland) Bill. I will allow a few momen...
The Deputy Presiding Officer (Elaine Smith) Lab
I call Kenny MacAskill to speak to and move the motion in the name of Roseanna Cunningham. Cabinet secretary, you have a maximum of 10 minutes but less would...
The Cabinet Secretary for Justice (Kenny MacAskill) SNP
I am delighted to open this stage 1 debate on the Courts Reform (Scotland) Bill. I record my thanks to the Justice Committee for its consideration of the bil...
Duncan McNeil (Greenock and Inverclyde) (Lab) Lab
The cabinet secretary mentioned asbestos cases. Over the years, he and others in the Parliament have done a lot of work for asbestos victims and their famili...
Kenny MacAskill SNP
That is a fair point. It is important to put on record that the whole purpose of Lord Gill’s review is to ensure that we get access to justice because the sy...
The Deputy Presiding Officer Lab
Thank you. I advise members that we are very tight for time. I call Christine Grahame to speak on behalf of the Justice Committee. You have a maximum of seve...
Christine Grahame (Midlothian South, Tweeddale and Lauderdale) (SNP) SNP
I welcome the opportunity to speak on behalf of the Justice Committee on this significant and complex bill, which, thankfully, has been without huge controve...
Elaine Murray (Dumfriesshire) (Lab) Lab
On behalf of the Labour members of the Justice Committee, I thank the clerks, and all the witnesses who gave evidence to the committee. I assure the Scottis...
Liam McArthur (Orkney Islands) (LD) LD
Could the member advise whether the committee sought views on the concerns that have been raised, certainly in my constituency, about the removal of honorary...
Elaine Murray Lab
That was part of the committee’s report—we considered that issue.
Christine Grahame SNP
It was in my speech but I had to cut it out because my time was cut.
Elaine Murray Lab
Congestion in the sheriff courts is likely therefore to persist for some time. We are concerned that if the requirement for corroboration is abolished, as th...
Margaret Mitchell (Central Scotland) (Con) Con
The bill represents years of endeavour by the Scottish civil courts review, which Lord President Gill led, and will implement overdue reforms to Scotland’s c...
The Deputy Presiding Officer Lab
We turn to the open debate. We are very tight for time. Speeches will be a maximum of four minutes. 16:52
Christian Allard (North East Scotland) (SNP) SNP
This is an important debate and I wish that we had more time for it. Yesterday, as the convener said, the committee went up town for a breath of fresh air....
The Deputy Presiding Officer Lab
Thank you very much. I am afraid that every second counts in the debate. Graeme Pearson, you have four minutes. 16:56
Graeme Pearson (South Scotland) (Lab) Lab
Thank you for allowing me to contribute this afternoon, Presiding Officer. I am pleased that section 69 of the Enterprise and Regulatory Reform Act 2013 has...
Christine Grahame SNP
Will the member take an intervention?
Graeme Pearson Lab
I am sorry—I am out of time. The advocate’s role in the process is important. The dean of the Faculty of Advocates raised an important issue about the foren...
The Deputy Presiding Officer Lab
Thank you. I am afraid that if members go over time by a few seconds, we will lose some members from the debate. 17:00
Roderick Campbell (North East Fife) (SNP) SNP
I refer members to my entry in the register of interests as a member of the Faculty of Advocates. There is, as the convener of the Justice Committee suggest...
Alison McInnes (North East Scotland) (LD) LD
Following Lord Gill’s review of the civil courts, he described the existing system as “failing to deliver justice ... expeditiously, economically or efficie...
Sandra White (Glasgow Kelvin) (SNP) SNP
I thank the previous speakers for their comprehensive speeches. In fact, they were so comprehensive that they have left with me with very little to add, but ...
John Pentland (Motherwell and Wishaw) (Lab) Lab
There is general support for court reform. Yes, we want to modernise Scottish courts; yes, we want to make the system more efficient; and yes, we want it to ...
Nigel Don (Angus North and Mearns) (SNP) SNP
I feel that I am something of an interloper in this debate, as I was not on the Justice Committee through the process, but the subject is fascinating and I w...
Malcolm Chisholm (Edinburgh Northern and Leith) (Lab) Lab
I am on the Finance Committee, which looked at the bill’s financial memorandum. It seems to me that there are three major mysteries and a few minor mysteries...
The Deputy Presiding Officer (John Scott) Con
Twenty seconds.
Malcolm Chisholm Lab
I will make three minor points. It was flagged up that there will be substantial costs in creating a new training programme for specialist sheriffs, that the...
The Deputy Presiding Officer Con
Many thanks. 17:22
John Finnie (Highlands and Islands) (Ind) Ind
It is a welcome focus for the Justice Committee to be looking at civil rather than criminal matters. Like my colleagues, I support the principles of the bill...