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Chamber

Meeting of the Parliament 28 January 2014

28 Jan 2014 · S4 · Meeting of the Parliament
Item of business
Tackling Child Sexual Exploitation in Scotland
Hepburn, Jamie SNP Cumbernauld and Kilsyth Watch on SPTV

I thank the committee for its work and Barnardo’s for its petition. David Stewart was right to talk about

“the dark corners of Scotland”.

None of us doubts how difficult and harrowing the subject must have been for the committee to deal with, but it could have considered no more important a subject. It would have been wrong to duck the issue just because it is difficult. The committee is to be commended for taking the issue forward and for bringing the debate to the chamber.

As a father and a human being, I find incredible the physical and mental damage that some people inflict on children and young people. Jackson Carlaw referred to the

“dark side of human behaviour”,

which is the least that we could describe the activities as. The young people who are affected deserve our protection and they deserve to live happy childhoods. It is always depressing beyond expression when we hear of those who have been exploited.

Recent revelations in the media have probably brought the issue to the fore, but it has—sadly—long been with us. David Stewart mentioned the depressing case studies that are set out in the report. They represent different stories and experiences, but all of them provide a litany of testimony to the fact that child sexual exploitation is a real and present danger in Scotland.

The questions for us, as a Parliament, are how we support those who have been affected, and how we will tackle the incidence of child exploitation in the future. The report is an important part of that consideration and I welcome it in that context. The committee made a number of recommendations, each of which is commendable in its own way. I might touch on some of them.

I do not think that the Scottish Government has responded to the report yet, so I look forward to seeing its response. However, it is clear that the Government has taken action to tackle child exploitation—for example, the minister referred to the ministerial short-life working group.

That brings me to one of the committee’s recommendations, which was to review the national strategy. I know that the working group has essentially undertaken work that has laid out a series of actions that will have to be taken to strengthen how we address child sexual exploitation. That seems to be similar to work that the committee has requested, and the point has been well made about action being taken rather than having another review.

Indeed the Scottish Government has taken other action, including the summit on internet safety, funding for respectme and ChildLine, and issuing advice to schools to encourage safe and responsible use of mobile phone technology in schools. We can see that the Scottish Government has undertaken a range of measures to tackle what is a pernicious social ill.

I note that one of the things that the petition called for was research into the nature and scope of child sexual exploitation. Of course, we have heard that the Government has commissioned the University of Bedfordshire to look at that work and the work that is being done in the Forth valley pilot to which the minister referred. Again, we can see the Government responding to the petition.

In saying that, we should recognise the difficulties that will always exist for us in establishing the prevalence of child sexual exploitation. The victims are understandably reluctant to come forward because they are concerned about not being believed, or they face intimidation, and there is often misplaced shame. The victims are not the people who should feel ashamed, but shame is often an issue, as was reflected in the case studies. There are difficulties in establishing the exact scale of the problem, but I agree that we should try to quantify it and I would welcome any efforts to do so.

However, I consider that it is rather more important to tackle the problem than it is to quantify it. After all, if one child is being exploited, that is too high a prevalence for our society to bear.

How we tackle the problem must be informed by involvement in the area. I agreed with Jackson Carlaw’s point, although I might paraphrase it slightly differently: we need to caution against the political class being seen to do something just because something needs to be done. We need to ensure the efficacy of any measures that we take.

In that regard, I will highlight a few concerns that have been raised by outside groups in briefings that have been provided ahead of today’s debate. The first is in education, which was picked up on by the committee. Scotland’s Commissioner for Children and Young People and Liam McArthur made the point about placing the work within the context of children’s rights, as set out in the United Nations Convention on the Rights of the Child. Article 29 is the right to education; the commissioner pointed out that

“Recent research with young people in Scotland revealed worrying attitudes to sexual health and consent ... and the sexual objectification of girls and young women highlight the need to tackle such attitudes.”

The commissioner suggests that:

“The Scottish Government’s forthcoming update of its guidance on Relationships, Sexual Health and Parenthood Education (RSHPE) provides one important opportunity”

to deal with education around these issues. Barnardo’s Scotland made the same point, as did Aberlour Child Care Trust. It would be interesting to hear the Scottish Government’s perspective on those views and how we can better educate our young people to be safe.

We also need to reflect the fact that the problem manifests itself in different ways in different places, and the role of child protection committees must also be viewed as important. In its briefing, Barnardo’s talks about how data can be shared better between child protection committees. That strikes me as an important point to make, so it would be useful to know how the Scottish Government is facilitating such information sharing.

I will close by talking about the role of parents in responding to concerns about child sexual exploitation. As a father, I consider that it is my responsibility to ensure, along with my wife, that my two children are aware of the dangers that exist. I do not want them to be overawed or weighed down by them, but to be aware. As parents, we aim to ensure that our young children grow up to have respect for themselves and respect for others. We do our best to bring them up in an environment that nourishes and cherishes. The role of the parent is an important part of the challenge in tackling child sexual exploitation. We know that, despite the best efforts of parents, young people sometimes get drawn into circumstances that we do not want them to get into.

We know that there are parents who are neglectful. Even further beyond my comprehension is that sometimes parents themselves are the perpetrators of that exploitation. It is right, therefore, that we have a strategy to try to deal with child sexual exploitation. I commend the Public Petitions Committee in that regard. I hope that when we return to this subject, we will see further progress on tackling the exploitation of Scotland’s young people.

16:00

In the same item of business

The Presiding Officer (Tricia Marwick) NPA
The next item of business is a debate on motion S4M-08840, in the name of David Stewart, on the report on tackling child sexual exploitation in Scotland. It ...
David Stewart (Highlands and Islands) (Lab) Lab
The Public Petitions Committee’s role, in my view, is to shine a light into the dark corners of Scotland, and there can be no darker corner than child sexual...
Margaret Mitchell (Central Scotland) (Con) Con
The member will be aware that adult survivors of childhood sexual abuse have welcomed the report, which focuses on child sexual exploitation, which includes ...
David Stewart Lab
The member has made some interesting points and I am happy to go along to her cross-party group in April to go through those points in a lot more detail. I t...
The Minister for Children and Young People (Aileen Campbell) SNP
I thank David Stewart and all the members of the Public Petitions Committee for their comprehensive work on child sexual exploitation. This is a debate that ...
Margaret Mitchell Con
Earlier, the minister mentioned the Rochdale case in greater Manchester. In that case, the national health service crisis intervention team helped to expose ...
Aileen Campbell SNP
I thank Margaret Mitchell for the clear interest that she takes in working to ensure that some of the issues that we are discussing are dealt with adequately...
Gil Paterson (Clydebank and Milngavie) (SNP) SNP
A view is starting to be heard that, rather than police forces, taxpayers and voluntary groups investigating the actions of people on the internet, internet ...
Aileen Campbell SNP
There are many different issues around internet safety—not least some of the particularly tragic incidents that happened last summer—which is why we held and...
Jayne Baxter (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Lab) Lab
I begin by thanking the Public Petitions Committee for its work in producing the report that we are debating today. My Labour colleagues and I join members ...
Jackson Carlaw (West Scotland) (Con) Con
I thank David Stewart for his opening speech, introducing the committee’s report. I add my thanks to those who gave evidence, the clerks and others who made ...
Aileen Campbell SNP
I have said that we want to take all the learning that we have and to have an action plan, so that we can take action, as opposed to having another prolonged...
Jackson Carlaw Con
I agree with the minister—I hope that I have not been giving a false impression. Any national strategy has to be based on actions, and I welcome what the min...
The Deputy Presiding Officer (John Scott) Con
We move to the open debate. We have a little time in hand. I can offer David Torrance, to be followed by Graeme Pearson, up to seven minutes. 15:14
David Torrance (Kirkcaldy) (SNP) SNP
I begin by thanking the committee clerking team for their hard work and their efforts in helping us put together the report. I also thank the numerous orga...
Graeme Pearson (South Scotland) (Lab) Lab
I offer my sincere thanks to three separate entities. First, I thank Barnardo’s for bringing forward the evidence that lay behind the petition, which resulte...
Aileen Campbell SNP
Will the member take an intervention?
Graeme Pearson Lab
I will, if the Presiding Officer is happy for me to do so.
The Deputy Presiding Officer Con
I am.
Aileen Campbell SNP
I am sorry for intervening at this stage; I had not quite realised how far into his allotted time the member was. I point out that, last year, we hosted a s...
Graeme Pearson Lab
I thank the minister for that intervention and I am happy to acknowledge her point. The use of chat rooms to choreograph the exploitation of children is a ne...
John Wilson (Central Scotland) (SNP) SNP
As a member of the Public Petitions Committee since 2008, I found the petition one of the most challenging that I have faced, given the subject matter that w...
Liam McArthur (Orkney Islands) (LD) LD
I congratulate David Stewart and his Public Petitions Committee colleagues on their work. The issue of child sexual exploitation is undoubtedly complex, and ...
Angus MacDonald (Falkirk East) (SNP) SNP
I hope that Parliament will bear with me as I speak with a heavy cold, but also with a heavy heart as we debate this horrendous subject. Child sexual exploit...
Jamie Hepburn (Cumbernauld and Kilsyth) (SNP) SNP
I thank the committee for its work and Barnardo’s for its petition. David Stewart was right to talk about “the dark corners of Scotland”. None of us doubts...
Neil Bibby (West Scotland) (Lab) Lab
I welcome the opportunity to speak in the debate. We often say that debates are important, but I cannot think of many debates that are more important than on...
George Adam (Paisley) (SNP) SNP
I, too, thank the committee for the difficult work that it undertook in its inquiry. As the convener, Dave Stewart, and Angus MacDonald said, if one child is...
Anne McTaggart (Glasgow) (Lab) Lab
I am especially pleased to participate in the debate, as I am a member of the Public Petitions Committee that produced the report on tackling child sexual ex...
Clare Adamson (Central Scotland) (SNP) SNP
I thank my colleagues who sit on the Public Petitions Committee for their dedication in bringing this important issue to the chamber. I echo Liam McArthur’s ...
Liam McArthur LD
I am very grateful to Clare Adamson for taking an intervention. She will know that I support the principle of the named person, but one of the concerns that ...