Hansard

The Presiding Officer (Tricia Marwick) NPA

The next item of business is a debate on motion S4M-11114, in the name of Graeme Pearson, on policing. 15:09

Graeme Pearson (South Scotland) (Lab) Lab

It is with some disappointment that I feel the need to move this motion. It is my belief that the Cabinet Secretary for Justice has abandoned his responsibil...

The Cabinet Secretary for Justice (Kenny MacAskill) SNP

We have discussed policing many times in the chamber over the past 18 months. The Parliament and three committees debated the legislation at length before it...

Elaine Murray (Dumfriesshire) (Lab) Lab

If that is the case—if there is that causation—why did crime in England and Wales fall 15 per cent last year, and why is it at its lowest point since records...

Kenny MacAskill SNP

Crime in England and Wales has not dropped as far or as fast as it has dropped in Scotland, but the decline in police numbers is significant and huge. Number...

Neil Findlay (Lothian) (Lab) Lab

Will the cabinet secretary give way?

Kenny MacAskill SNP

Not at the moment. That is not only my view, but the view of Niven Rennie, the president of the Association of Scottish Police Superintendents, who said thi...

Graeme Pearson Lab

Will the cabinet secretary give way?

Kenny MacAskill SNP

In a minute. Let me be clear: operational independence is different from accountability. The chief constable is solely responsible for decisions to enforce ...

Neil Findlay Lab

Will cabinet secretary take an intervention?

Kenny MacAskill SNP

I am coming into my last minute. Interruption.

The Presiding Officer NPA

Order.

Kenny MacAskill SNP

We have come a long way since the early stages of reform and the arrangements are now much more effective. The SPA stands for not simply holding the police t...

Margaret Mitchell (Central Scotland) (Con) Con

It is important to stress at the outset that since Police Scotland was formed more than 18 months ago, front-line police officers have worked tremendously ha...

The Deputy Presiding Officer (Elaine Smith) Lab

The member must conclude.

Margaret Mitchell Con

It is the cabinet secretary’s duty to ensure the effectiveness of the checks and balances that should guarantee the enforcement of essential accountability f...

The Deputy Presiding Officer Lab

I am afraid that the member must close.

Margaret Mitchell Con

In that respect, the cabinet secretary’s stewardship has been totally inept. I move amendment S4M-11114.1, to leave out from “responsibility” to end and ins...

The Deputy Presiding Officer Lab

We are very tight for time this afternoon. If members wish to speak in the debate, they must press their request-to-speak button. Members must stick to a ver...

Kevin Stewart (Aberdeen Central) (SNP) SNP

Graeme Pearson, in his opening speech, asked, “Who watches the watchers?”, and his motion mentions responsibility, accountability, scrutiny and challenge. I...

Bruce Crawford (Stirling) (SNP) SNP

Does the member agree that the fact that there are now only five or maybe six Labour members in the chamber and the fact that only half the afternoon has bee...

The Deputy Presiding Officer Lab

You are approaching your final minute, Mr Stewart.

Kevin Stewart SNP

I agree that it is completely a political stunt. I would go much further, because I agree with Brian Docherty that this is about “point-scoring politicians” ...

The Deputy Presiding Officer Lab

Come to a close, please.

Kevin Stewart SNP

From some members, we have seen flip-flopping on the issue to create instability and to interfere and point score.

The Deputy Presiding Officer Lab

I am afraid that you must close.

Kevin Stewart SNP

That has got to stop.

The Deputy Presiding Officer Lab

Members must keep strictly to four minutes, please. 15:36

Elaine Murray (Dumfriesshire) (Lab) Lab

Like other members, I welcomed last week’s announcement by the chief constable that he had jettisoned his policy of deploying armed police officers on routin...

Christian Allard (North East Scotland) (SNP) SNP

I am afraid that four minutes is far too short to debate the 203 words in the motion that Graeme Pearson, the Labour justice spokesman, has put before us. Le...