Chamber
Meeting of the Parliament 02 April 2014
02 Apr 2014 · S4 · Meeting of the Parliament
Item of business
Stop and Search
I welcome the chance to respond to the motion lodged by Alison McInnes.
Stop and search is an important issue, so it is disappointing that the Liberal Democrats have chosen to be so negative in how they have addressed it not just today but in the past weeks. Alison McInnes’s motion sets out a number of concerns about stop and search but brings little, if anything, in the way of evidence of problems to the Parliament. She talks about unfounded searches, children being stopped without reason and people’s human rights being abused. On top of that, Graeme Pearson has lodged an amendment claiming that there is no oversight of the stop and searches being carried out and is calling for investigation by Audit Scotland.
I must tell the Parliament that I do not recognise much of that story at all. I have therefore lodged a detailed amendment to set out the position as it is on our streets and in our communities. Let us be clear: the responsibility for operational issues, such as stop and search, lies firmly with the chief constable. That is why this Parliament set up Police Scotland a year ago and why we appoint a chief constable in the first place.
In the same item of business
The Deputy Presiding Officer (John Scott)
Con
The next item of business is a debate on motion S4M-09557, in the name of Alison McInnes, on stop and search. 14:40
Alison McInnes (North East Scotland) (LD)
LD
It is a privilege to open the debate on behalf of the Scottish Liberal Democrats. Yesterday marked the first anniversary of Police Scotland and the aboliti...
Kevin Stewart (Aberdeen Central) (SNP)
SNP
Will the member give way?
Alison McInnes
LD
Not at the moment. We will, therefore, introduce amendments to the Criminal Justice (Scotland) Bill and present Parliament with an opportunity to improve th...
The Deputy Presiding Officer
Con
I call Kenny MacAskill, the Cabinet Secretary for Justice, to speak to and move amendment S4M-09557.2. You have seven minutes. I make it clear that we are ti...
The Cabinet Secretary for Justice (Kenny MacAskill)
SNP
I welcome the chance to respond to the motion lodged by Alison McInnes. Stop and search is an important issue, so it is disappointing that the Liberal Democ...
Annabel Goldie (West Scotland) (Con)
Con
I have listened with interest to what the cabinet secretary says, and I have looked at the text of his amendment. When it comes to policing in Scotland from ...
Kenny MacAskill
SNP
Not at all. I have just come from a meeting with the police and the Police Investigations and Review Commissioner. We established through Parliament—by a maj...
Willie Rennie (Mid Scotland and Fife) (LD)
LD
The cabinet secretary is fond of quoting statistics, but what was the success rate of the so-called voluntary stop and searches?
Kenny MacAskill
SNP
I cannot give the member that precisely, but what he will see is that the proof of the pudding is in the eating. Alcohol and knives are taken from many of th...
The Deputy Presiding Officer
Con
I call Graeme Pearson to speak to and move amendment S4M-09557.1. Mr Pearson, you have up to five minutes. 14:57
Graeme Pearson (South Scotland) (Lab)
Lab
I rise to move the amendment in my name, which, because of the Government’s pre-emptive amendment, is unlikely to be voted on. To that extent I am disappoint...
The Deputy Presiding Officer (Elaine Smith)
Lab
Please draw to a close.
Graeme Pearson
Lab
I will indeed, Presiding Officer. In the same magazine, the chief constable asks whether people “seriously think” that the police should go to the public to...
Margaret Mitchell (Central Scotland) (Con)
Con
At the outset, I confirm that I very much support the ability of police officers to stop and search suspects. It is an important power in the fight against c...
The Deputy Presiding Officer
Lab
We now come to the open debate. We are very tight for time, so speeches should be a maximum of four minutes, please. 15:07
Sandra White (Glasgow Kelvin) (SNP)
SNP
I think that we agree that we all want crime to be tackled and our communities to be made safer. It is to be welcomed that recorded crime is at a 39-year low...
Margaret Mitchell
Con
Will the member give way?
Sandra White
SNP
I am sorry, but I do not have time. If those kids in Glasgow had been down by the Clyde drinking alcohol until midnight or 1 o’clock at night, something cou...
John Pentland (Motherwell and Wishaw) (Lab)
Lab
I thank the Liberal Democrats for lodging their motion. Disappointingly, the amendment from the Cabinet Secretary for Justice merely reinforces the impressio...
The Deputy Presiding Officer
Lab
Mr Pentland, will you pull your microphone round towards you, please?
John Pentland
Lab
We do not know whether that is a tenth of our population or fewer people suffering more searches, but we know that the figure is four times that for England ...
Roderick Campbell (North East Fife) (SNP)
SNP
I will begin by stating what is perhaps the obvious, which is that I am completely against the idea of fiddled or made-up figures from any public body. I am ...
Alison McInnes
LD
Will the member take an intervention?
Roderick Campbell
SNP
I am sorry, but I do not have time. I am sure that we all accept that we live in a very different world from that of 50 years ago or even 20 years ago. Over...
Alison McInnes
LD
Will the member take an intervention?
Roderick Campbell
SNP
I am sorry, but time prevents me from doing so. In evidence to the Justice Sub-Committee on Policing on 20 March, Police Scotland revealed that the rate of ...
Hugh Henry (Renfrewshire South) (Lab)
Lab
I want to put on record my support for stop and search. Indeed, as a minister, I played some part in ensuring that additional powers were made available to t...
Christian Allard (North East Scotland) (SNP)
SNP
I am delighted to participate in the debate, as it is always a pleasure to respond to Liberal Democrat members who want to compare Scotland’s achievements in...
Alison McInnes
LD
That demonstrates what I do support, which is statutory stop and search, on reasonable suspicion and intelligence led. What I am debating this afternoon and ...