Chamber
Meeting of the Parliament 22 April 2014
22 Apr 2014 · S4 · Meeting of the Parliament
Item of business
Scotland’s Voice in the European Union
I am reflecting on how strange it will be not to hear Margo MacDonald’s voice and distinctive position in this debate on Europe.
In the next few weeks, citizens of Europe, including those in Scotland, will vote for new members of the European Parliament. I thank all the current six members of the European Parliament from all parties in Scotland for their service to Scotland over the past five years. A new European Parliament will be formed with a new Parliament President, and later this year a new European Commission President and college of commissioners will be appointed. The EU budget from 2014 to 2020 has been agreed, agendas for the next session are being formed, and many are already established. It is therefore an appropriate time to think about where the EU stands, the challenges that it faces, the opportunities that it affords, and the role of Scotland, our institutions, including Parliament and Government, and our 5 million citizens of the EU.
I hope that whatever our interparty disagreements, as evidenced in the amendments, we can articulate a Scottish European voice that recognises and does not reject the role of Europe; that articulates a positive and productive reform agenda to improve the EU, but from within it; and which sets out a progressive and reasonable voice on the EU that rejects the shrill, prejudiced, fearful and aggressive voice on the EU that frequently emanates from politicians in other parts of the United Kingdom. The Scottish Government thinks that the progressive voice and the reasoned argument for reform can best be delivered with Scotland as an independent country. That is what I will articulate today, although I suspect that other parties will disagree with that.
Let us remind ourselves why Europe matters. We need to remind ourselves of the importance of bringing together European nations that had previously been in conflict, and that the agenda for peace and security still has an underpinning role. Europe’s work on common concern about the environment, the challenges of the developing world, co-operation on international security and tackling terrorism, and expanding trade affects people’s wellbeing, safety and jobs. Europe has opened up borders for trade and commerce with the single market approach, and has expanded international trade. It has also set regulatory frameworks that much of the world has copied.
I note the amendment that was lodged by the Green Party and will listen to the argument, but we are supportive of the transatlantic trade and investment partnership, although we agree that it needs more scrutiny. That is more difficult for a devolved, rather than independent, Parliament.
In the next few weeks, citizens of Europe, including those in Scotland, will vote for new members of the European Parliament. I thank all the current six members of the European Parliament from all parties in Scotland for their service to Scotland over the past five years. A new European Parliament will be formed with a new Parliament President, and later this year a new European Commission President and college of commissioners will be appointed. The EU budget from 2014 to 2020 has been agreed, agendas for the next session are being formed, and many are already established. It is therefore an appropriate time to think about where the EU stands, the challenges that it faces, the opportunities that it affords, and the role of Scotland, our institutions, including Parliament and Government, and our 5 million citizens of the EU.
I hope that whatever our interparty disagreements, as evidenced in the amendments, we can articulate a Scottish European voice that recognises and does not reject the role of Europe; that articulates a positive and productive reform agenda to improve the EU, but from within it; and which sets out a progressive and reasonable voice on the EU that rejects the shrill, prejudiced, fearful and aggressive voice on the EU that frequently emanates from politicians in other parts of the United Kingdom. The Scottish Government thinks that the progressive voice and the reasoned argument for reform can best be delivered with Scotland as an independent country. That is what I will articulate today, although I suspect that other parties will disagree with that.
Let us remind ourselves why Europe matters. We need to remind ourselves of the importance of bringing together European nations that had previously been in conflict, and that the agenda for peace and security still has an underpinning role. Europe’s work on common concern about the environment, the challenges of the developing world, co-operation on international security and tackling terrorism, and expanding trade affects people’s wellbeing, safety and jobs. Europe has opened up borders for trade and commerce with the single market approach, and has expanded international trade. It has also set regulatory frameworks that much of the world has copied.
I note the amendment that was lodged by the Green Party and will listen to the argument, but we are supportive of the transatlantic trade and investment partnership, although we agree that it needs more scrutiny. That is more difficult for a devolved, rather than independent, Parliament.
In the same item of business
The Presiding Officer (Tricia Marwick)
NPA
The next item of business is a debate on motion S4M-09748, in the name of Fiona Hyslop, on Scotland’s voice in the European Union.15:19
The Cabinet Secretary for Culture and External Affairs (Fiona Hyslop)
SNP
I am reflecting on how strange it will be not to hear Margo MacDonald’s voice and distinctive position in this debate on Europe.In the next few weeks, citize...
Patrick Harvie (Glasgow) (Green)
Green
I am interested in the cabinet secretary’s comments and regret that there will not be a vote on the Green amendment. Has she discussed with Mike Weir, Eilidh...
Fiona Hyslop
SNP
That is why I want to give the opportunity to discuss scrutiny; people can challenge the transatlantic trade and investment partnership without disagreeing w...
Willie Rennie (Mid Scotland and Fife) (LD)
LD
The cabinet secretary appears to be in the mood for revealing information. For the past year, I have been asking for the First Minister’s speech to EU ambass...
Fiona Hyslop
SNP
If Willie Rennie speaks to ministers in the UK Government, he will be told that it is not acceptable, nor is it the norm, to reveal discussions that take pla...
Drew Smith (Glasgow) (Lab)
Lab
The Deputy First Minister has said that membership of the euro is her red line. Which of the reforms that the cabinet secretary proposes would be a red line ...
Fiona Hyslop
SNP
I refer Drew Smith to the white paper, “Scotland’s Future”, in which we talk about “continuity of effect”, which means that there will be no detriment to oth...
Patricia Ferguson (Glasgow Maryhill and Springburn) (Lab)
Lab
This is, of course, the first debate in the Parliament since the sad death of Margo MacDonald, and as such it is the first of many debates in which we will n...
Stewart Stevenson (Banffshire and Buchan Coast) (SNP)
SNP
Will Patricia Ferguson take an intervention?
Patricia Ferguson
Lab
I am happy to take an intervention from Mr Stevenson.
Stewart Stevenson
SNP
Patricia Ferguson will of course be wholly familiar with the acquis communautaire that is the constitution of the EU. Is she familiar with section 50, which ...
Patricia Ferguson
Lab
I gently point out to Mr Stevenson that, in actual fact, the UK is the only state in these islands that has signed the treaties of the EU. If we divorce ours...
Stewart Stevenson
SNP
No.
Patricia Ferguson
Lab
I have to say to Mr Stevenson that I think that we will both have to wait and find out what the actual situation is, because the one thing that is absolutely...
The Deputy Presiding Officer (John Scott)
Con
Order.
Patricia Ferguson
Lab
Having noted that the Scottish Government now accepts that there will have to be a period of negotiation—I do not know whether Mr Stevenson was trying to sug...
Fiona Hyslop
SNP
Will Patricia Ferguson give way?
Patricia Ferguson
Lab
If the cabinet secretary can clarify that point, I will be happy to do so.
Fiona Hyslop
SNP
It is about basic democracy and sovereignty. We can choose to pool our sovereignty in the EU, but currently there is no choice.
Patricia Ferguson
Lab
I am sorry that that is the kind of logic that has come to bear on the SNP’s position. It seems bizarre that the SNP would want to pool sovereignty in a situ...
Kevin Stewart (Aberdeen Central) (SNP)
SNP
Will Patricia Ferguson give way?
Patricia Ferguson
Lab
No.The Scottish Government will tell the European Union that, in our case, it should use article 48 and that it should simply allow us to join by way of a tr...
Kevin Stewart
SNP
Will the member give way?
Patricia Ferguson
Lab
No, thank you, Mr Stewart.The fact of the matter is that article 49 of the treaty is the only existing mechanism by which membership can be negotiated. Just ...
The Deputy Presiding Officer
Con
Can we have a bit of courtesy, please?
Patricia Ferguson
Lab
The SNP also presumes that all 28 member states would be happy to allow Scotland to join the EU on its own terms, but that seems unlikely to me.
Christian Allard (North East Scotland) (SNP)
SNP
Will Patricia Ferguson take an intervention?
Patricia Ferguson
Lab
I have already taken a number of interventions, thank you.Let me speak more specifically of the terms of Scotland’s membership. The SNP wants—no: it demands—...
Annabel Goldie (West Scotland) (Con)
Con
I thank the Scottish Government for enabling Parliament to debate the European Union. With an imminent election in May and the referendum in September, it is...