Chamber
Meeting of the Parliament 19 February 2014
19 Feb 2014 · S4 · Meeting of the Parliament
Item of business
Children and Young People (Scotland) Bill: Stage 3
As I said at stage 2, the reason why we require the addition of the UN Convention on the Rights of Persons with Disabilities is to give additional assurance that disabled children’s views are embedded in the bill and given due regard in all aspects of policy development.
I understand that the Government is satisfied that the UNCRC requirements are sufficient to provide that and, at stage 2, the minister stated that
“the rights set out under the UNCRC apply equally to all children, including disabled children.”—[Official Report, Education and Culture Committee, 17 December 2013; c 3158.]
However, if that was indeed the case, I do not believe that the UN would itself have set out an additional assurance with the UNCRPD.
More emphasis should be placed on ensuring that the Children and Young People (Scotland) Bill makes adequate provision for the rights of disabled children to be realised. Embedding such a provision in primary legislation would build a strong foundation for public authorities around Scotland to adjust their practice and procedures to reflect the national intention to uphold disabled children’s rights.
I also understand that the Scottish Government does not wish to highlight specific groups of children and seeks to promote the notion of universality. However, given that the bill specifically mentions looked-after children, the precedent has already been set and it would be remiss of the bill not to mention disabled children in the way that I propose.
The minister will be aware that my proposed amendments are supported by the Health and Social Care Alliance Scotland, Enable Scotland and Children 1st.
Notwithstanding the fact that there is a problem with the financial memorandum and that we in the Labour Party are concerned about the financial support that is available for the bill, I urge the minister to support amendment 92 and all other amendments in this group.
I move amendment 92.
I understand that the Government is satisfied that the UNCRC requirements are sufficient to provide that and, at stage 2, the minister stated that
“the rights set out under the UNCRC apply equally to all children, including disabled children.”—[Official Report, Education and Culture Committee, 17 December 2013; c 3158.]
However, if that was indeed the case, I do not believe that the UN would itself have set out an additional assurance with the UNCRPD.
More emphasis should be placed on ensuring that the Children and Young People (Scotland) Bill makes adequate provision for the rights of disabled children to be realised. Embedding such a provision in primary legislation would build a strong foundation for public authorities around Scotland to adjust their practice and procedures to reflect the national intention to uphold disabled children’s rights.
I also understand that the Scottish Government does not wish to highlight specific groups of children and seeks to promote the notion of universality. However, given that the bill specifically mentions looked-after children, the precedent has already been set and it would be remiss of the bill not to mention disabled children in the way that I propose.
The minister will be aware that my proposed amendments are supported by the Health and Social Care Alliance Scotland, Enable Scotland and Children 1st.
Notwithstanding the fact that there is a problem with the financial memorandum and that we in the Labour Party are concerned about the financial support that is available for the bill, I urge the minister to support amendment 92 and all other amendments in this group.
I move amendment 92.
In the same item of business
The Deputy Presiding Officer (Elaine Smith)
Lab
We move to stage 3 proceedings on the Children and Young People (Scotland) Bill. Members should have copies of the bill as amended at stage 2, the marshalled...
The Deputy Presiding Officer
Lab
Group 1 is on duties of Scottish ministers in relation to the rights of children. Amendment 116, in the name of Jean Urquhart, is grouped with amendments 117...
Jean Urquhart (Highlands and Islands) (Ind)
Ind
The stated policy intention behind the bill is to contribute to Scotland being the best place for children to grow up, and I applaud that intention. It is vi...
Liam McArthur (Orkney Islands) (LD)
LD
The bill represents the coming together of two pieces of proposed legislation, one of which is a bill on children’s rights. As Jean Urquhart identified, the ...
The Minister for Children and Young People (Aileen Campbell)
SNP
I welcome the opportunity to respond to the range of amendments that focus on part 1 of the bill. The bill will ensure that children’s rights properly influe...
Liam McArthur
LD
I listened carefully to what the minister said. She seemed to be concerned that amendment 125 overlaps with amendment 126. That would make sense if she inten...
Aileen Campbell
SNP
As I have said, we are developing that. That is something that we will achieve in order to ensure that we make rights real for children and that the UNCRC is...
Alison Johnstone (Lothian) (Green)
Green
It has, at times, been difficult to articulate through this bill the potential impact of the United Nations convention on the rights of the child on children...
Neil Bibby (West Scotland) (Lab)
Lab
I welcome the opportunity to speak to amendments 121, 123 and 124 in my name as well as the other amendments in the group.Although I join members of all part...
Liz Smith (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Con)
Con
Over a lengthy period, I have listened very carefully to what has been the most challenging but nevertheless one of the most interesting aspects of the debat...
Joan McAlpine (South Scotland) (SNP)
SNP
Like Liz Smith, I listened as part of the Education and Culture Committee to the evidence on this section of the bill. Like the rest of the committee, I came...
The Deputy Presiding Officer (John Scott)
Con
Minister, would you like to respond to any of the points that were made in the debate? You do not have to by any measure.
Aileen Campbell
SNP
Joan McAlpine raised the fact that the committee did not support the full incorporation of the UNCRC, and I reflect again on Professor Ken Norrie’s comments ...
Jean Urquhart
Ind
I return to the wording of amendment 116 and reiterate what it would do and what it would not. It would require Scottish ministers to set up a body to consid...
The Deputy Presiding Officer
Con
I am afraid that I did not hear what you said. Are you pressing or withdrawing your amendment?
Jean Urquhart
Ind
I am upholding it—I am pressing it.
The Deputy Presiding Officer
Con
Right. The question is, that amendment 116 be agreed to. Are we agreed?Members: No.
The Deputy Presiding Officer
Con
There will be a division. We will have it shortly, as there will now be a five-minute gap—the word I am looking for is “suspension”.14:40 Meeting suspended. ...
The Deputy Presiding Officer
Con
We move to the division on amendment 116.ForBaillie, Jackie (Dumbarton) (Lab) Baker, Claire (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Lab) Baker, Richard (North East Scotland...
The Deputy Presiding Officer
Con
The result of the division is: For 36, Against 84, Abstentions 0.Amendment 116 disagreed to.Section 1—Duties of Scottish Ministers in relation to the rights ...
The Deputy Presiding Officer
Con
The question is, that amendment 117 be agreed to. Are we agreed?Members: No.
The Deputy Presiding Officer
Con
There will be a division.ForBaillie, Jackie (Dumbarton) (Lab) Baker, Claire (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Lab) Baker, Richard (North East Scotland) (Lab) Baxter, ...
The Deputy Presiding Officer
Con
The result of the division is: For 55, Against 65, Abstentions 0.Amendment 117 disagreed to.Amendment 118 moved—Liam McArthur.
The Deputy Presiding Officer
Con
The question is, that amendment 118 be agreed to. Are we agreed?Members: No.
The Deputy Presiding Officer
Con
There will be a division.ForBaillie, Jackie (Dumbarton) (Lab) Baker, Claire (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Lab) Baker, Richard (North East Scotland) (Lab) Baxter, ...
The Deputy Presiding Officer
Con
The result of the division is: For 56, Against 65, Abstentions 0.Amendment 118 disagreed to.
The Deputy Presiding Officer
Con
Group 2 is on duties in relation to article 7 of the UN Convention on the Rights of Persons with Disabilities. Amendment 92, in the name of Siobhan McMahon, ...
Siobhan McMahon (Central Scotland) (Lab)
Lab
As I said at stage 2, the reason why we require the addition of the UN Convention on the Rights of Persons with Disabilities is to give additional assurance ...
Liz Smith
Con
As I mentioned at stage 2, I have a great deal of sympathy for the intent of Siobhan McMahon’s amendments, and by bringing them to stage 3, she has allowed u...
Aileen Campbell
SNP
Amendments 92 and 94 to 100 seek to place requirements on Scottish ministers and public bodies to take steps with the aim of furthering the rights set out un...