Chamber
Meeting of the Parliament 29 May 2013
29 May 2013 · S4 · Meeting of the Parliament
Item of business
Automatic External Defibrillators
I am sure that it is a great relief to members that the Minister for Public Health is here to respond to the debate. As I recall, he was a member of Scotland’s emergency services when he was a member of a mountain rescue team. I am sure that he is more than adequately trained, should any of us require first responder intervention.
This is an excellent and opportune debate. The motion is comprehensive and covers many of the bases. The key underlying point is that early intervention dramatically improves the likelihood of a good outcome in the long term.
Nanette Milne and Malcolm Chisholm talked about the related intervention of cardiopulmonary resuscitation. We should say a little more about that, because as anyone will know who has been trained to do CPR, as I have—albeit that I must be incredibly rusty now—it is easy to watch and difficult to do. A person must have the confidence to put their full weight into CPR as they press on the chest of the person who is suffering a heart attack. They must be prepared to break ribs, if that is what it takes. In older people, that can be a consequence.
In light of that, we must consider the practical training that is given to people if they are to administer CPR. It is not a question of having a bit of paper that tells one how to do it; people need to realise that it needs a lot of physical effort. I hope that we tak tent of that. I am sure that Laura and Paul Macadam-Slater, who are trained first-aiders, are familiar with the issue, which is partly why CPR is mentioned in the motion.
There are other, simple things that people should be trained to do at school. For example, youngsters should know how to get someone into the recovery position. Such an intervention can be decisive in ensuring a person’s survival, given that vomiting can be associated with a heart attack and someone who is in the wrong position can drown in their own vomit. People should be taught the recovery position.
I represent many of Scotland’s fishermen. These days, a large proportion of fishing boats carry AEDs, which are vastly easier to use than the kind of equipment that Dr Milne used, which came in some time after my father graduated in medicine.
There is a small personal element to this debate. In 1930, long before I was born, my grandfather had a heart attack on what was then the lower station in Dunfermline, and that was the end of him. I would like to think that if that had happened today, CPR or intervention via an AED would have meant that he could have lived beyond his 68 years.
I hope that the debate stimulates wider interest and that we hear interesting things from the minister. I also hope that the minister will not have to make a personal intervention and use his previous training.
17:29
This is an excellent and opportune debate. The motion is comprehensive and covers many of the bases. The key underlying point is that early intervention dramatically improves the likelihood of a good outcome in the long term.
Nanette Milne and Malcolm Chisholm talked about the related intervention of cardiopulmonary resuscitation. We should say a little more about that, because as anyone will know who has been trained to do CPR, as I have—albeit that I must be incredibly rusty now—it is easy to watch and difficult to do. A person must have the confidence to put their full weight into CPR as they press on the chest of the person who is suffering a heart attack. They must be prepared to break ribs, if that is what it takes. In older people, that can be a consequence.
In light of that, we must consider the practical training that is given to people if they are to administer CPR. It is not a question of having a bit of paper that tells one how to do it; people need to realise that it needs a lot of physical effort. I hope that we tak tent of that. I am sure that Laura and Paul Macadam-Slater, who are trained first-aiders, are familiar with the issue, which is partly why CPR is mentioned in the motion.
There are other, simple things that people should be trained to do at school. For example, youngsters should know how to get someone into the recovery position. Such an intervention can be decisive in ensuring a person’s survival, given that vomiting can be associated with a heart attack and someone who is in the wrong position can drown in their own vomit. People should be taught the recovery position.
I represent many of Scotland’s fishermen. These days, a large proportion of fishing boats carry AEDs, which are vastly easier to use than the kind of equipment that Dr Milne used, which came in some time after my father graduated in medicine.
There is a small personal element to this debate. In 1930, long before I was born, my grandfather had a heart attack on what was then the lower station in Dunfermline, and that was the end of him. I would like to think that if that had happened today, CPR or intervention via an AED would have meant that he could have lived beyond his 68 years.
I hope that the debate stimulates wider interest and that we hear interesting things from the minister. I also hope that the minister will not have to make a personal intervention and use his previous training.
17:29
In the same item of business
The Deputy Presiding Officer (Elaine Smith)
Lab
The final item of business today is a members’ business debate on motion S4M-06362, in the name of Margaret Mitchell, on automatic external defibrillators in...
Margaret Mitchell (Central Scotland) (Con)
Con
The campaign for AEDs, or automatic external defibrillators, in Scotland is run by first-aiders Laura and Paul Macadam-Slater, who briefed MSPs about the iss...
The Deputy Presiding Officer
Lab
Excuse me, Mrs Mitchell. Could I stop you for a moment? People who are leaving the gallery should do so quietly. Parliament is in session.
Margaret Mitchell
Con
The survival chances of people who are affected by cardiac arrest decrease by 14 per cent for every minute without defibrillation. Furthermore, 70 per cent o...
The Deputy Presiding Officer
Lab
Thank you very much. I apologise for the earlier interruption.I ask for four-minute speeches, as we are quite tight for time.17:12
Aileen McLeod (South Scotland) (SNP)
SNP
First, I congratulate Margaret Mitchell on securing the debate. I must also give my apologies, as I will have to leave the chamber before the minister respon...
Malcolm Chisholm (Edinburgh Northern and Leith) (Lab)
Lab
I congratulate Margaret Mitchell on lodging this important motion and I look forward to the rest of the debate, including the minister’s speech, because the ...
The Deputy Presiding Officer
Lab
I must ask you to conclude.
Malcolm Chisholm
Lab
I ought to add that part of the training is about CPR, which might also be required. That wider education of young people is crucial, but having the devices ...
Nanette Milne (North East Scotland) (Con)
Con
I, too, congratulate my colleague Margaret Mitchell on securing the debate so that we can acknowledge the work of the AEDs in Scotland campaign, which seeks ...
Stewart Stevenson (Banffshire and Buchan Coast) (SNP)
SNP
I am sure that it is a great relief to members that the Minister for Public Health is here to respond to the debate. As I recall, he was a member of Scotland...
Siobhan McMahon (Central Scotland) (Lab)
Lab
I congratulate Margaret Mitchell on bringing the debate to the Parliament.I have spoken in the Parliament about the use of AEDs in Scotland, so I welcome the...
Fiona McLeod (Strathkelvin and Bearsden) (SNP)
SNP
I, too, thank Margaret Mitchell for bringing the debate to the Parliament. In following Siobhan McMahon, I remember her members’ business debate in November ...
The Minister for Public Health (Michael Matheson)
SNP
As others have done, I congratulate Margaret Mitchell on securing time for this important debate.The sudden and unexpected death of a young person that has b...