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Committee

Enterprise and Culture Committee, 16 Jan 2007

16 Jan 2007 · S2 · Enterprise and Culture Committee
Item of business
“Growing older and wiser together—A futures view on positive ageing”
Lord Sutherland of Houndwood (Scotland's Futures Forum Aging Project Board): Watch on SPTV
I noted that you are a director of the futures forum, convener, and I hold that to your credit rather than hold you to account for it. I welcome the opportunity to meet the committee and to present the work of many others. The advisory board's role was to advise; the actual work was done by Robert Rae and his colleagues, to whom I pay tribute. Robert is sitting behind me and I am sure that several of the other people who were involved will take a close interest and welcome the interest that is being shown by a major committee of the Scottish Parliament.I have enjoyed working with good people and stimulating ideas, but probably what I most liked about the project was the idea of the futures forum and of the Parliament and parliamentarians looking into the future. I will not say that that is a change of culture, because that would insult members. However, a welcome and important facet of any worthwhile Parliament's work is looking beyond, rather than being driven by, tomorrow's headlines—I understand it if members are preoccupied with May's elections; that is all right and is part of the job. However, looking to the issues that will shape Scottish society in 10, 15 and 20 years is essential if we are to get things right. It is also essential, as members will know from press coverage of the report, if we are to avoid throwing our hands in the air and crying crisis when to do so is unnecessary.The report's theme and point are to provoke thought, discussion with the wider community—much of which is represented today—and action after that. To some extent, that is over to members, but not only to members. Three parties are involved in the issue. The first is the Executive, the second is the business community, for reasons that I am sure we will go into in great detail, and the third is the individual—what help does the individual need to think through the implications of a significant change that is taking place in our society?Members will note that the report has a title and a strapline that follows it. I have covered the strapline, "A futures view on positive ageing". I do not know about the title, "Growing older and wiser together". I have got the growing older bit covered, but I am not sure that I have quite mastered the growing wiser. However, that is me rather than the report.The point of the report is to focus minds on an issue that we know is already changing our society—the Parliament has been deeply involved in some of these matters—and will continue to do so at a wholly predictable rate, which means that we can make sensible preparations. The problem is not going to turn up out of the blue. We have known for decades that the demography of our country is changing. You have all seen the numbers and the way in which the population is moving towards the upper age range. The number of people who will, in the end, depend on those who are in work to provide the growth in the economy that will continue the quality of life for which we all hope is growing significantly larger.I have an example. Statistically speaking, during this meeting our life expectancy will grow by between 10 and 15 minutes. I cannot allocate that to each person here individually, but that is the reality. During the time it takes to have this meeting, our life expectancy will go up, so I hope that it is shared out equally all round.

In the same item of business

The Convener (Alex Neil): SNP
It is 2 o'clock and most members who will attend the meeting are here, so I welcome everybody to the Enterprise and Culture Committee's second meeting in 200...
Christine May (Central Fife) (Lab): Lab
Can we debate that?
The Convener: SNP
Perhaps I should declare an interest as a person who is rapidly aging, too.I welcome Lord Sutherland and ask him to say a few words of introduction.
Lord Sutherland of Houndwood (Scotland's Futures Forum Aging Project Board):
I noted that you are a director of the futures forum, convener, and I hold that to your credit rather than hold you to account for it. I welcome the opportun...
Christine May: Lab
Only among the deserving.
Lord Sutherland:
There is an optimist. I like optimism in politicians; it is very important.The methods that were used by those who carried out the work under Robert Rae's di...
The Convener: SNP
Thank you very much indeed. That was excellent. The purpose of these round-table discussions at the Enterprise and Culture Committee is to identify some of t...
Lord Sutherland:
The report did not focus on that in detail, so there is no special set of research evidence, but I am happy to give you my tuppenceworth if you want. I chair...
The Convener: SNP
The committee's remit includes science policy, so that is highly relevant.
Susan Deacon (Edinburgh East and Musselburgh) (Lab): Lab
Are we moving seamlessly on to the round-table discussion?
The Convener: SNP
Yes.
Susan Deacon: Lab
I want to pick up where the convener left off, not by asking a question, but by commenting on the thinking behind the report. The report is extremely helpful...
The Convener: SNP
That is a good issue on which to broaden out the discussion. I will come back to Stewart Sutherland in a minute, but I should now introduce all the other par...
Lord Sutherland:
I will be quick. We did not set out to analyse in detail some of the additional costs because, as Susan Deacon said, much of that work has been done and ther...
The Convener: SNP
Does anyone else want to respond? I cannot believe that David Manion does not want to.
David Manion (Age Concern Scotland):
I am the chief executive of Age Concern Scotland. It is a great pity that Professor Phil Hanlon is not with us to provide his insights on public health-relat...
Murdo Fraser (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Con): Con
My question follows on quite neatly from Susan Deacon's question on costs. The idea that an aging population will be a problem for the Chancellor of the Exch...
The Convener: SNP
We should also distinguish between the retirement age and the pension age, which are not necessarily the same thing.
Tara Brady (B&Q plc):
As the employment relations and diversity manager for B&Q, I guess that I come from a very pro place. We believe that there are significant commercial benefi...
Christine May: Lab
Could I pick up on something on page 16 of the report? Lord Sutherland referred to intergenerational well-being and the need for older people to mentor young...
Tara Brady:
A related question that I am often asked is how our older employees feel when they are managed by somebody younger. It is a common stereotype that it is a go...
The Convener: SNP
A former boss of mine used to say, "Age doesn't make you a sage. It just makes you an old man."
David Manion:
I would like to say something about future costs. If we do not do something, the costs will be even worse, and it is the cost of not doing something that we ...
Christine May: Lab
That is an extremely interesting point and I suspect that some of my colleagues will pick it up, but I will focus for one more moment on mentoring.In a schem...
Lord Sutherland:
Absolutely. We should look for such examples of good practice and, where appropriate, replicate them. It is not easy for people to move into the workforce, e...
Ian Naismith (Scottish Widows):
I am the head of pensions market development at Scottish Widows. We have examined employer attitudes and health. One aspect that we have examined closely is ...
The Convener: SNP
Is part of that the fact that in many parts of Scotland—particularly parts of Glasgow—male life expectancy might be 58 or 63, so men in those areas cannot ex...
Ian Naismith:
Yes—that is probably an element. We did not examine cities specifically, but we did not find appreciable differences across the salary range on the age to wh...
Shiona Baird (North East Scotland) (Green): Green
The report is fascinating and I would like to pick up on many issues. I wonder whether the point that was made is just a question of perception. People may f...
The Convener: SNP
I will bring in Linda Boyes at this stage, as the Scottish Council Foundation has probably considered some of those points. I will then invite Fiona Hird, fr...