Committee
Justice Committee 11 December 2012
11 Dec 2012 · S4 · Justice Committee
Item of business
School Exclusions and Offending
Our paper on the issue starts with a discussion of the link between exclusion and offending. As the evidence has been laid out in the discussion, we have discovered that informal exclusion is a major element, which, by its nature, is presumably not tracked by any formal study. We have also found that there is self-exclusion through truancy. Those are two major elements that go along with the formal exclusion process.To be honest, I do not believe for a moment that the 40 per cent decline in exclusions has anything to do with behaviour in schools over the past six years. I am not saying that it has got worse, but I am sceptical that it is 40 per cent better than it was six years ago. We have to be realistic about that. We have not yet talked about the consequences in schools of things such as assaults on staff and pupils. A few weeks ago, there was a tragic trial involving a boy who had killed one of his classmates. That was a terrible situation. I am not saying that the event was linked to an exclusion, but we cannot ignore the fact that it happened and is a reality for the parents of both those boys. What evidence is there that behaviour in schools is better or worse?
In the same item of business
The Convener
SNP
Item 3 on the agenda is a round-table discussion on the connection between school exclusions and offending. Alison McInnes suggested the topic back in Februa...
Jenny Marra
Lab
I am a member of the Scottish Parliament for North East Scotland and I am deputy convener of the committee.
Alan Staff (Apex Scotland)
I am the chief executive officer of Apex Scotland. My background is in child and adolescent psychiatry and addictions.
David McLetchie
Con
I am an MSP for Lothian.
John Butcher (Association of Directors of Education in Scotland)
I am head of inclusion at Glasgow City Council and am representing ADES.
Roderick Campbell (North East Fife) (SNP)
SNP
I am the MSP for North East Fife.
Vivienne Sutherland (Association of Scottish Principal Educational Psychologists)
I am a depute principal educational psychologist in Fife and am representing the Association of Scottish Principal Educational Psychologists.
Colin Keir (Edinburgh Western) (SNP)
SNP
I am the MSP for Edinburgh Western.
Susan Quinn (Educational Institute of Scotland)
I am the president of the EIS.
John Finnie (Highlands and Islands) (Ind)
Ind
I am a Highlands and Islands MSP.
Maggie Fallon (Education Scotland)
I am from the rights, support and wellbeing team in Education Scotland.
Sandra White (Glasgow Kelvin) (SNP)
SNP
I am the MSP for Glasgow Kelvin.
Nico Juetten (Office of Scotland's Commissioner for Children and Young People)
I work for Scotland’s Commissioner for Children and Young People.
Colin Morrison (Pupil Inclusion Network Scotland)
I am from the pupil inclusion network.
Alison McInnes (North East Scotland) (LD)
LD
I am an MSP for North East Scotland.
Jim Thewliss (School Leaders Scotland)
Good morning. In my day job, I am headteacher at Harris academy in Dundee. I am representing SLS.
Eileen Prior (Scottish Parent Teacher Council)
Hello. I am from the Scottish Parent Teacher Council.
Graeme Pearson (South Scotland) (Lab)
Lab
I am a member of the Scottish Parliament for South Scotland.
Professor Pamela Munn (Moray House School of Education)
I am from the University of Edinburgh.
Professor Susan McVie (Edinburgh Study of Youth Transitions and Crime)
I, too, am from the University of Edinburgh.
The Convener
SNP
I am the convener of the committee and the MSP for Midlothian South, Tweeddale and Lauderdale. I like saying that constituency name, as it is long.I will thr...
Alan Staff
We are getting it wrong.
The Convener
SNP
There is controversy. Good.
Alan Staff
Absolutely.The majority of young people who are excluded have already begun an offending background. They already commit a range of minor offences. Excluding...
Susan Quinn
I do not think that we are particularly getting things wrong. Anybody in society would hope that we would never exclude any child, but there are multiple rea...
The Convener
SNP
Can you expand on what you said about some support systems no longer being available?
Susan Quinn
Absolutely. For example, a colleague approached me a month ago about a difficulty in a secondary school. I asked what the behaviour policy was and she said t...
Professor Munn
I would not say that we are getting it right, but I think that we are getting it better. The vast majority of young people who are excluded from school are e...
John Butcher
In many ways, I agree with Professor Munn. I think that we are getting it right and I do not agree that we are getting it wrong. We are on the road to gettin...
Jim Thewliss
In my previous life I was a geography teacher and I am married to a history teacher, so I am used to challenging and difficult questions from history teacher...