Chamber
Meeting of the Parliament 24 October 2012
24 Oct 2012 · S4 · Meeting of the Parliament
Item of business
Winter Resilience
I welcome the debate and thank the minister for bringing forward—for the second time, I believe, after last year’s debate—a debate on winter resilience at the beginning of the winter, when we can talk about things in the cold light of day, without getting involved in the heated type of discussion that we had two years ago at the expense of a minister.
The weather over the British isles is extremely unpredictable. Those of us who have made a study of climate change and the science behind it will realise that the one thing that will happen as a result of global warming is not that Britain will get any warmer but that our weather will become even less predictable. Some people might suspect that attempting to predict the weather and to improve winter resilience is a losing battle in the long term, but it is our duty to do all that we can to ensure that every lesson is learned and that mistakes that have been made in one incident are not repeated in the next. That is why debates such as today’s are so valuable.
I want to cover a couple of issues, the first of which comes under the broad heading of transport. The worst experiences that I had during the winter period at the end of 2010 related to the unpredictability of rail services. I am well aware of why the rail services between here and my home in Stonehaven were as bad as they were—the weather was obviously the cause—but a serious problem at the time was the shortage of heated points on the east coast main line north of Edinburgh. Can the minister inform us whether more of the points on that route will be heated and will therefore not freeze as they did during that period?
My main problem with the rail system at the time was one that other members have highlighted—it was to do with the issue of information. The inaccuracy of the information about rail services that was available during that period was probably a bigger problem than the lack of rail services. My worst experience was one that I have told the chamber about before. When my wife phoned the national rail information line, she spoke to a very nice Indian lady who told her that there were no reported problems with rail services in Scotland, even though, as far as we could see, there were no trains at all running in Scotland that day. The importance of information can never be overstated. I am glad that the minister has already been able to say more about how information for travellers will be improved.
Another point about transport that I will make relates to roads—my amendment is about roads issues in particular. I share the concerns that are expressed in the Labour Party’s amendment about the danger that local authorities, for whatever reason, may have decided to save money on preparedness for the winter. I would like further reassurance from the minister that we do not have local authorities in Scotland that have failed to make adequate provision and that will be unable to provide the necessary support to keep roads open and clear of ice and snow should we suffer a bad period of snow and ice during the winter. It would be an extreme disappointment if the lessons of previous years have not been learned and if a single mild winter has been enough to encourage some councils to return to their old ways.
Another roads issue is the quality and maintenance of infrastructure. The lesson that I learned from 2010 was that many of the problems on our roads were associated with poor long-term maintenance. If there is a pothole and a man goes round to fill it with tar and roll it flat, the problem is that if there is snow, and it melts, and if a snowplough passes over the top of it, it is not long before the fill that was put in the pothole is thrown back out. I saw individual potholes in my own backyard filled and refilled on up to four occasions during the six-week period at the end of 2010. For that reason, we need to take a long-term approach and encourage local authorities to be as responsible as possible in dealing with that issue.
The weather over the British isles is extremely unpredictable. Those of us who have made a study of climate change and the science behind it will realise that the one thing that will happen as a result of global warming is not that Britain will get any warmer but that our weather will become even less predictable. Some people might suspect that attempting to predict the weather and to improve winter resilience is a losing battle in the long term, but it is our duty to do all that we can to ensure that every lesson is learned and that mistakes that have been made in one incident are not repeated in the next. That is why debates such as today’s are so valuable.
I want to cover a couple of issues, the first of which comes under the broad heading of transport. The worst experiences that I had during the winter period at the end of 2010 related to the unpredictability of rail services. I am well aware of why the rail services between here and my home in Stonehaven were as bad as they were—the weather was obviously the cause—but a serious problem at the time was the shortage of heated points on the east coast main line north of Edinburgh. Can the minister inform us whether more of the points on that route will be heated and will therefore not freeze as they did during that period?
My main problem with the rail system at the time was one that other members have highlighted—it was to do with the issue of information. The inaccuracy of the information about rail services that was available during that period was probably a bigger problem than the lack of rail services. My worst experience was one that I have told the chamber about before. When my wife phoned the national rail information line, she spoke to a very nice Indian lady who told her that there were no reported problems with rail services in Scotland, even though, as far as we could see, there were no trains at all running in Scotland that day. The importance of information can never be overstated. I am glad that the minister has already been able to say more about how information for travellers will be improved.
Another point about transport that I will make relates to roads—my amendment is about roads issues in particular. I share the concerns that are expressed in the Labour Party’s amendment about the danger that local authorities, for whatever reason, may have decided to save money on preparedness for the winter. I would like further reassurance from the minister that we do not have local authorities in Scotland that have failed to make adequate provision and that will be unable to provide the necessary support to keep roads open and clear of ice and snow should we suffer a bad period of snow and ice during the winter. It would be an extreme disappointment if the lessons of previous years have not been learned and if a single mild winter has been enough to encourage some councils to return to their old ways.
Another roads issue is the quality and maintenance of infrastructure. The lesson that I learned from 2010 was that many of the problems on our roads were associated with poor long-term maintenance. If there is a pothole and a man goes round to fill it with tar and roll it flat, the problem is that if there is snow, and it melts, and if a snowplough passes over the top of it, it is not long before the fill that was put in the pothole is thrown back out. I saw individual potholes in my own backyard filled and refilled on up to four occasions during the six-week period at the end of 2010. For that reason, we need to take a long-term approach and encourage local authorities to be as responsible as possible in dealing with that issue.
In the same item of business
The Presiding Officer (Tricia Marwick)
NPA
The next item of business is a debate on motion S4M-04518, in the name of Keith Brown, on winter resilience.14:42
The Minister for Transport and Veteran Affairs (Keith Brown)
SNP
Presiding Officer, thank you for the opportunity to update members on how Scotland is becoming more resilient, year on year, in the face of severe weather, a...
Alison Johnstone (Lothian) (Green)
Green
Will the minister give way?
Keith Brown
SNP
I give way to Alison Johnstone.
Alison Johnstone
Green
Speaking about new technologies—
The Deputy Presiding Officer (Elaine Smith)
Lab
Could we have Alison Johnstone’s microphone on please? Please put your card in, Ms Johnstone.
Alison Johnstone
Green
Speaking about new technologies, the minister may be aware that the Dutch are about to test heated cycle paths that will use heat that has been gathered duri...
Keith Brown
SNP
I made the point at the start of my speech that we want to keep Scotland moving. To the extent that they will help keep Scotland moving, I am more than willi...
Margo MacDonald (Lothian) (Ind)
Ind
I thank the minister for giving way near the end of his speech. I was waiting for what I thought would be the crescendo. What is the Government going to do a...
The Deputy Presiding Officer
Lab
Minister, you must conclude, please.
Keith Brown
SNP
I think that Margo MacDonald has stolen Alex Johnstone’s thunder. We have procedures in place to deal with potholes. My responsibility is for trunk roads, an...
Elaine Murray (Dumfriesshire) (Lab)
Lab
As the minister said, long-range weather forecasting is notoriously unreliable because weather patterns are influenced by many factors, including variations ...
Keith Brown
SNP
It is worth looking behind some of the figures that Elaine Murray cited. Last year, many local authorities had very high levels of salt but did not use it be...
Elaine Murray
Lab
I thank the minister for that clarification of the issues in the article. However, councils are implementing cuts not because they do not take winter resilie...
Mark McDonald (North East Scotland) (SNP)
SNP
It is my recollection from my time as a local councillor that the funding for repairs to the road network to deal with potholes, for example, came from counc...
The Deputy Presiding Officer
Lab
You are in your final minute, Dr Murray.
Elaine Murray
Lab
Capital budgets are under huge pressure as well—it is not just revenue budgets that are under pressure. I did not mention revenue budgets specifically and, w...
The Deputy Presiding Officer
Lab
You must close now, Dr Murray.
Elaine Murray
Lab
That information needs to be put in the public domain in advance of any prolonged period of severe winter weather.I move amendment S4M-04518.1, to insert at ...
Alex Johnstone (North East Scotland) (Con)
Con
I welcome the debate and thank the minister for bringing forward—for the second time, I believe, after last year’s debate—a debate on winter resilience at th...
Mark McDonald
SNP
Does the member agree that another issue that arises is when the road is dug up—by a utility company, for example—and then not properly filled in or patched ...
The Deputy Presiding Officer
Lab
Mr Johnstone, you are going into your last minute.
Alex Johnstone
Con
Absolutely, I would not dispute that what the member describes is an issue.I will have to move quickly to ensure that I cover some of the other points that I...
Jim Hume (South Scotland) (LD)
LD
The last days of October are fast becoming characterised not by gaining an extra hour, or by Hallowe’en, but by the annual winter resilience debate in the ch...
The Deputy Presiding Officer
Lab
We turn to the open debate. At this stage of the debate, we are tight for time and it is unlikely that I will be able to call all members to speak. Speeches ...
Chic Brodie (South Scotland) (SNP)
SNP
I, too, welcome the debate and acknowledge the considerable work that the Minister for Transport and Veteran Affairs, his officials, the services and the Red...
Claudia Beamish (South Scotland) (Lab)
Lab
I highlight the recent Citizens Advice Scotland energy briefing, which says that the Scottish Government and local authorities might be able to help with rur...
Chic Brodie
SNP
That point is well made and noted.The resilience programme should be packaged under the two themes of communication and equipment availability. It is good ne...
Margo MacDonald
Ind
Will the member give way?
Chic Brodie
SNP
No, I must finish.We do not just have to deal with domestic issues. It is critical that airports and cross-border rail links continue to operate effectively....