Chamber
Meeting of the Parliament 24 May 2012
24 May 2012 · S4 · Meeting of the Parliament
Item of business
Languages (Improving Opportunities)
As a passionate Eurovision fan—that might not come as a surprise—I can say that it is noticeable that since the language restrictions of the 1990s, whereby all songs were required to be submitted in the native language, were lifted, Ireland and the UK, which had the advantage of the English language, have stopped doing as well as they used to do. There is perhaps an interesting point in there somewhere.
In this country, the choice of second language is not automatic, so we have to make an active case for the language that we teach. French has been the default language for a long time, but German, demand for which has declined, and Spanish and other languages of Latin America and the far east, demand for which has grown, all compete for a limited slot, and a considerable case has to be made to win over the minds of adults. The Barcelona agreement contains an ambitious target, which will be especially ambitious for Scotland.
In preparation for the debate, I looked up last year’s standard grade exam in German reading, to see how much I could remember from my schooldays. I think that, with a dictionary and a bit of luck, I might have made a decent stab at it, but I took German far beyond standard grade, and I do not think that the ability to muddle my way through the exam constitutes a basis for a claim to multilingualism. Our stats on people who take languages at standard grade show a consistent downward trend.
Turning the trend around will never be easy, but there is an obligation in that regard. If, as I said, multilingualism brings benefits and the rest of Europe has a head start, we must ensure that we do not allow permanent disadvantage to emerge relative to the rest of Europe. We have a duty to the Scottish society of tomorrow.
Professor Richard Johnstone, writing for SCILT in 2002, said that immersion is:
“In most cases ... not simply an educational initiative but has a powerful underlying socio-cultural rationale, which gives it its driving force and creates the commitment to it, without which it is unlikely to succeed.”
He gave examples such as the approach in Canada, which has distinctive cultural relations, and the 50-50 Spanish-English schools in immigrant-heavy parts of the United States. We need something similar if we are to succeed. Pilots would be a great start, but in a decade’s time we must have such nationwide recognition of the importance of languages.
It is important that those of us who can only stumble over a sentence of a foreign language that is half-remembered from school hold up our hands and admit that we have not set the best example. It is easy to load responsibility on to the next generation and say that education is the solution, but we must acknowledge that adult expectations and behaviour will matter a great deal if we want to reach the 1+2 Barcelona target.
In this country, the choice of second language is not automatic, so we have to make an active case for the language that we teach. French has been the default language for a long time, but German, demand for which has declined, and Spanish and other languages of Latin America and the far east, demand for which has grown, all compete for a limited slot, and a considerable case has to be made to win over the minds of adults. The Barcelona agreement contains an ambitious target, which will be especially ambitious for Scotland.
In preparation for the debate, I looked up last year’s standard grade exam in German reading, to see how much I could remember from my schooldays. I think that, with a dictionary and a bit of luck, I might have made a decent stab at it, but I took German far beyond standard grade, and I do not think that the ability to muddle my way through the exam constitutes a basis for a claim to multilingualism. Our stats on people who take languages at standard grade show a consistent downward trend.
Turning the trend around will never be easy, but there is an obligation in that regard. If, as I said, multilingualism brings benefits and the rest of Europe has a head start, we must ensure that we do not allow permanent disadvantage to emerge relative to the rest of Europe. We have a duty to the Scottish society of tomorrow.
Professor Richard Johnstone, writing for SCILT in 2002, said that immersion is:
“In most cases ... not simply an educational initiative but has a powerful underlying socio-cultural rationale, which gives it its driving force and creates the commitment to it, without which it is unlikely to succeed.”
He gave examples such as the approach in Canada, which has distinctive cultural relations, and the 50-50 Spanish-English schools in immigrant-heavy parts of the United States. We need something similar if we are to succeed. Pilots would be a great start, but in a decade’s time we must have such nationwide recognition of the importance of languages.
It is important that those of us who can only stumble over a sentence of a foreign language that is half-remembered from school hold up our hands and admit that we have not set the best example. It is easy to load responsibility on to the next generation and say that education is the solution, but we must acknowledge that adult expectations and behaviour will matter a great deal if we want to reach the 1+2 Barcelona target.
In the same item of business
The Presiding Officer (Tricia Marwick)
NPA
The next item of business is a debate on motion S4M-03004, in the name of Alasdair Allan, on why languages matter—improving young people’s opportunities.09:16
The Minister for Learning, Science and Scotland’s Languages (Dr Alasdair Allan)
SNP
Bonjour. Guten Tag. I am delighted to open the debate on why languages matter—improving young people’s opportunities. This is a welcome opportunity to discus...
Malcolm Chisholm (Edinburgh Northern and Leith) (Lab)
Lab
I welcome the key messages in the report. The report says that in most European countries children start to learn a second language between the ages of six a...
Dr Allan
SNP
I thank the member for that considered point. The situation varies very much not just from country to country, but from school to school. We would be realist...
Liam McArthur (Orkney Islands) (LD)
LD
Will the minister take an intervention?
Dr Allan
SNP
I have just taken one. Give me a moment.
Liam McArthur
LD
It is on that point.
Dr Allan
SNP
Well, why not?
Liam McArthur
LD
I thank the minister for relenting. My comment relates to Malcolm’s Chisholm’s point. A lot of the evidence suggests that, by the time that children reach th...
Dr Allan
SNP
I readily agree with that. The younger that we introduce language learning, the more receptive children are likely to be to it. Implementation of the recomme...
Kezia Dugdale (Lothian) (Lab)
Lab
Will the minister give way?
Dr Allan
SNP
I am in my last minute.In the meantime, we will provide £120,000 to fund pilot projects to be run in the 2012-13 school year by Education Scotland and Scotla...
The Presiding Officer
NPA
Before I call Neil Findlay, I ask members who speak in a second language during the debate—I do not mean just saying “Bonjour” or “Guten Tag”—to provide a tr...
Neil Findlay (Lothian) (Lab)
Lab
Merci, Presiding Officer. I can provide that to the official report if you require, but I do not think that I will worry the interpreters much more in my spe...
Liz Smith (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Con)
Con
In recent weeks politicians, including many in this Parliament, have been on the receiving end of some very blunt advice from employers in Scotland, much of ...
Dr Allan
SNP
I appreciate many of the sentiments that the member has expressed. On her last point, does she also agree that, for pupils who are perhaps challenged by lite...
Liz Smith
Con
Yes. I do not deny that for a minute. However, the point that the language teachers are making is that it enhances pupils’ ability to learn the structures of...
The Presiding Officer
NPA
We have a bit of time in hand for the open debate, so members will have a generous six minutes for speeches. If members take interventions, I am sure that we...
Marco Biagi (Edinburgh Central) (SNP)
SNP
Members will be delighted to hear that I will attempt no linguistic feats—it took me long enough to rehearse my affirmation last year. I have enough difficul...
Neil Findlay
Lab
As the member will know, we are about to have the Eurovision song contest, so maybe his horizons will be expanded.
Marco Biagi
SNP
As a passionate Eurovision fan—that might not come as a surprise—I can say that it is noticeable that since the language restrictions of the 1990s, whereby a...
The Presiding Officer
NPA
I remind members that I will give them a generous six minutes. I call Claudia Beamish.09:54
Claudia Beamish (South Scotland) (Lab)
Lab
Thank you, Presiding Officer. If I translated my speech into French, I would need a lot longer than your generous six minutes.
The Presiding Officer
NPA
Feel free.
Claudia Beamish
Lab
I will stick to my own language. I rise today to speak in support of the Government’s motion and our amendment, which concern the ambition to improve the opp...
Maureen Watt (Aberdeen South and North Kincardine) (SNP)
SNP
I am delighted to take part in the debate. Many members in the chamber already know of my passion for language learning and how knowledge of languages certai...
Stuart McMillan (West Scotland) (SNP)
SNP
When I was listening to Claudia Beamish’s closing comments about Italian, I was taken back to the time when I studied in France and Germany. As a vegetarian ...
The Deputy Presiding Officer (John Scott)
Con
You have seven minutes.
Stuart McMillan
SNP
Thank you, Presiding Officer. In the time that I have, I have struggled to cut down some of my real-life experiences that show why languages matter but, towa...
Kevin Stewart (Aberdeen Central) (SNP)
SNP
Folk have talked about exchange trips, but it strikes me, as I listen to the debate, that people do not take advantage of what we have here at this moment. W...