Chamber
Meeting of the Parliament 14 March 2012
14 Mar 2012 · S4 · Meeting of the Parliament
Item of business
Alcohol (Minimum Pricing) (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1
I am pleased to open the debate on the general principles of the Alcohol (Minimum Pricing) (Scotland) Bill. I do so with a sense of déjà vu, although I hope that that will be dispelled by reaching a different outcome this time from the one the last time the subject was debated.
I thank the organisations and individuals who have helped to shape our minimum pricing policy—some of them are represented in the public gallery. I thank Duncan McNeil and the Health and Sport Committee and its clerking team for the committee’s careful and robust scrutiny of our proposals and the considered conclusions that it reached in its stage 1 report. Similarly, I thank colleagues on the Finance Committee and the Subordinate Legislation Committee for the part that they played in scrutinising the bill. I am also grateful to the many and varied witnesses who provided invaluable evidence to the committees.
I offer final thanks to the Liberal Democrats and the Conservatives. I have many differences with them, but it is to their great credit that, since the last vote on the issue, they have decided to join the Scottish National Party and the Greens by giving minimum pricing a chance.
Before discussing the substance of the Health and Sport Committee’s stage 1 report, I will take some time to remind members why the measures in the bill are important. I make it clear at the outset, as I hope I have been clear all along, that the Scottish Government is not anti-alcohol. We are not against drinking, but we are very much against the problems that are associated with excessive consumption of alcohol.
The hard fact is that, over the years, Scotland’s relationship with alcohol has got increasingly out of kilter and needs to be rebalanced. Since at least 2000, enough alcohol has been sold each week in Scotland to allow every adult to exceed the recommended weekly limit for men. It might be uncomfortable for any of us to admit it, but sales figures suggest that we drink almost a quarter more than do people in other parts of the United Kingdom.
In the past 15 years, a significant shift has taken place not just in how much we drink but in where we drink. Nearly 70 per cent of alcohol is now sold through the off-trade, and that shift has been driven largely by price and affordability. In 2010, the average price of a unit of alcohol in the on-trade was £1.34, in comparison with just 45p in the off-trade. In real terms, the affordability of alcohol in the on-trade has remained fairly static, but the affordability of off-trade alcohol has shifted significantly.
As all of us know from our constituency experiences and from other sources, excessive drinking is taking its toll on every age group, every socioeconomic group and every community across the country. It places huge pressure on our national health service, our police service and our local authorities. The associated costs are immense, at more than £3.6 billion every year, which is £900 for every adult in the country.
The cost tells only part of the story. In human terms, too, we pay a heavy price. In the past few decades, rates of chronic liver disease have trebled, alcohol-related deaths have doubled and alcohol-related hospital admissions have quadrupled. Of course, we also suffer from alcohol-related crime and disorder. In 2009, half of Scottish prisoners and 77 per cent of young offenders admitted to being drunk when they committed their offence.
I have no doubt at all that if we are to achieve our ambition—which I believe everyone in the Parliament shares—of a self-confident Scotland in which alcohol can be enjoyed sensibly as a pleasurable part of life, we need to take firm action now to rebalance our relationship with alcohol.
It is also important to say again, as I have said all along, that our alcohol industry is an important part of our economy. As we do now, we will continue to offer support to businesses to grow, including in the export market, and we will work with those businesses to use all the levers that are at their disposal to assist in reducing alcohol consumption, including, for example, where appropriate, promoting lower-strength products.
I thank the organisations and individuals who have helped to shape our minimum pricing policy—some of them are represented in the public gallery. I thank Duncan McNeil and the Health and Sport Committee and its clerking team for the committee’s careful and robust scrutiny of our proposals and the considered conclusions that it reached in its stage 1 report. Similarly, I thank colleagues on the Finance Committee and the Subordinate Legislation Committee for the part that they played in scrutinising the bill. I am also grateful to the many and varied witnesses who provided invaluable evidence to the committees.
I offer final thanks to the Liberal Democrats and the Conservatives. I have many differences with them, but it is to their great credit that, since the last vote on the issue, they have decided to join the Scottish National Party and the Greens by giving minimum pricing a chance.
Before discussing the substance of the Health and Sport Committee’s stage 1 report, I will take some time to remind members why the measures in the bill are important. I make it clear at the outset, as I hope I have been clear all along, that the Scottish Government is not anti-alcohol. We are not against drinking, but we are very much against the problems that are associated with excessive consumption of alcohol.
The hard fact is that, over the years, Scotland’s relationship with alcohol has got increasingly out of kilter and needs to be rebalanced. Since at least 2000, enough alcohol has been sold each week in Scotland to allow every adult to exceed the recommended weekly limit for men. It might be uncomfortable for any of us to admit it, but sales figures suggest that we drink almost a quarter more than do people in other parts of the United Kingdom.
In the past 15 years, a significant shift has taken place not just in how much we drink but in where we drink. Nearly 70 per cent of alcohol is now sold through the off-trade, and that shift has been driven largely by price and affordability. In 2010, the average price of a unit of alcohol in the on-trade was £1.34, in comparison with just 45p in the off-trade. In real terms, the affordability of alcohol in the on-trade has remained fairly static, but the affordability of off-trade alcohol has shifted significantly.
As all of us know from our constituency experiences and from other sources, excessive drinking is taking its toll on every age group, every socioeconomic group and every community across the country. It places huge pressure on our national health service, our police service and our local authorities. The associated costs are immense, at more than £3.6 billion every year, which is £900 for every adult in the country.
The cost tells only part of the story. In human terms, too, we pay a heavy price. In the past few decades, rates of chronic liver disease have trebled, alcohol-related deaths have doubled and alcohol-related hospital admissions have quadrupled. Of course, we also suffer from alcohol-related crime and disorder. In 2009, half of Scottish prisoners and 77 per cent of young offenders admitted to being drunk when they committed their offence.
I have no doubt at all that if we are to achieve our ambition—which I believe everyone in the Parliament shares—of a self-confident Scotland in which alcohol can be enjoyed sensibly as a pleasurable part of life, we need to take firm action now to rebalance our relationship with alcohol.
It is also important to say again, as I have said all along, that our alcohol industry is an important part of our economy. As we do now, we will continue to offer support to businesses to grow, including in the export market, and we will work with those businesses to use all the levers that are at their disposal to assist in reducing alcohol consumption, including, for example, where appropriate, promoting lower-strength products.
In the same item of business
The Deputy Presiding Officer (John Scott)
Con
The next item of business is a debate on motion S4M-02305, in the name of Nicola Sturgeon, on the Alcohol (Minimum Pricing) (Scotland) Bill. I call the cabin...
The Deputy First Minister and Cabinet Secretary for Health, Wellbeing and Cities Strategy (Nicola Sturgeon)
SNP
I am pleased to open the debate on the general principles of the Alcohol (Minimum Pricing) (Scotland) Bill. I do so with a sense of déjà vu, although I hope ...
Patrick Harvie (Glasgow) (Green)
Green
I have made this point before but I will make it again. Does the Government share the view that we should also think about the ownership structure of the alc...
Nicola Sturgeon
SNP
The bill seeks to deal with bigger issues than that. Our alcohol industry has a great deal to offer our country and its economy and it is in the industry’s i...
Dr Richard Simpson (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Lab)
Lab
This is not the first time, nor even the second time, that alcohol excess has become a major issue of public alarm in Scotland and the United Kingdom—in fact...
Christine Grahame (Midlothian South, Tweeddale and Lauderdale) (SNP)
SNP
I remind Dr Simpson that Labour’s attempt to introduce a measure on caffeinated drinks came very late in the day—I know because I was there. The Health and S...
Dr Simpson
Lab
I have said that we thought that the evidence was there, and that was confirmed two weeks after the debate by America’s ban. The evidence is now there.We als...
Nicola Sturgeon
SNP
I have already said that I am happy to discuss with Labour all the proposals. The question for Richard Simpson is: what does Labour propose to do about the p...
Dr Simpson
Lab
I will come to that but the fact is that, since the election, we have not been offered any discussions on the problem at all.The SNP has said repeatedly that...
Nicola Sturgeon
SNP
Richard Simpson must take care not to misrepresent the Sheffield model. The Sheffield team found a slightly smaller but still significant impact on 18 to 24-...
Dr Simpson
Lab
I am sorry if I am getting under the cabinet secretary’s skin, but it is important that we lay things out. I quote specifically from the Sheffield report and...
The Deputy Presiding Officer
Con
I call on Duncan McNeil to speak on behalf of the Health and Sport Committee. You have 10 minutes, Mr McNeil.15:30
Duncan McNeil (Greenock and Inverclyde) (Lab)
Lab
Thank you, Presiding Officer. I apologise to you and the cabinet secretary for missing her opening remarks. There was a bit of confusion.The eyes of the worl...
Christine Grahame
SNP
I do not want to take on the committee’s convener, but I am going to. From the tone of his speech, I am not quite sure whether he is speaking for the committ...
Duncan McNeil
Lab
I regret the intervention and the inference that I am not responding correctly or appropriately to the committee’s report. The report laid out a majority vie...
Ruth Davidson (Glasgow) (Con)
Con
Despite the cabinet secretary’s sense of déjà vu, the Scottish Conservatives approach this debate rather differently from our approaches to previous debates ...
Jackie Baillie (Dumbarton) (Lab)
Lab
It would be helpful if the member clarified whether the Tories intend that the entirety of the bill, or simply the order-making power, should be notified to ...
Ruth Davidson
Con
We would like quite comprehensive notification to the European Commission. In making a voluntary submission, we will have discharged our duty of full diligen...
Bob Doris (Glasgow) (SNP)
SNP
We will take forward the Alcohol (Minimum Pricing) (Scotland) Bill as a majority Scottish Government. That brings certainty to the process. However, I am ple...
Malcolm Chisholm (Edinburgh Northern and Leith) (Lab)
Lab
As the member knows, I supported the arguments for minimum pricing that the cabinet secretary put forward, and I still do. However, I found it rather odd tha...
Bob Doris
SNP
The Scottish Government always takes a sensible approach to taxing the supermarkets—something on which the Labour Party has not been consistent.I want to dis...
Jackie Baillie
Lab
Will the member take an intervention?
Bob Doris
SNP
I do not have time.I want to examine some of Labour’s misleading claims against minimum pricing, for instance in relation to binge drinking. The Health and S...
Graeme Pearson (South Scotland) (Lab)
Lab
It is with some concern that I enter the debate. Over the decades, I have become used to the notion that when alcohol is present in any discussion it can cau...
John Finnie (Highlands and Islands) (SNP)
SNP
Given the member’s background and his knowledge of the effect of alcohol on society, are the views that he is expressing his or his party’s?
Graeme Pearson
Lab
The views that I have expressed thus far are based on my experience of nearly 40 years in law enforcement. The member is familiar with the debates that have ...
Christine Grahame
SNP
Those are all superb and worthy examples, but it would certainly be possible to have minimum unit pricing alongside the measures that the member very reasona...
The Deputy Presiding Officer (Elaine Smith)
Lab
The member has 30 seconds left.
Graeme Pearson
Lab
We are here to debate our way forward in that regard, and I have no doubt that, at the debate’s conclusion, we will all make our choices.Alcohol offences inf...
The Deputy Presiding Officer
Lab
The member must come to a conclusion.