Chamber
Meeting of the Parliament 09 June 2011
09 Jun 2011 · S4 · Meeting of the Parliament
Item of business
Caring for Scotland’s Older People
I do not believe that there is any evidence to support the idea that the public sector is somehow intrinsically better than the private sector, and I do not believe that the quality of care in the private sector is governed by profit or loss. Our discussion today indicates that the regulatory system that is in place is sound, and we need to ensure that it improves.
Let me move on to a couple of specific issues. One area that has given me some concern is the reducing budget for wardens in sheltered housing—in Aberdeenshire at least. I picked up on the issue during the election campaign, when a number of people chose to raise it with me. I am concerned that there appears to be a trend in local authorities to prioritising cutting the cost of the services while not necessarily taking into account how best value can be achieved for the limited expenditure that is possible.
The specific case that I came across is a proposal to share warden services between two areas of sheltered accommodation that are 16 miles apart. The point of any such decision is, of course, to allow the providers to cut the number of staff or hours, but the effect is that transport will have to be provided, sometimes in emergencies or poor weather conditions, between the two sites.
It strikes me that there is an inconsistency in the way that budget cuts are being applied. Is the cabinet secretary in a position to express an opinion on how efficiencies are best achieved in areas such as sheltered housing? It is my intention to discuss the issue in significantly greater detail with council officials and some of the residents who may be affected.
We are in a difficult position. There have been a number of horrifying incidents, not least the case of Mrs V in Dundee. The issue has been put back on our agenda at a time when we must treat budgetary efficiency as a key element of how we ensure that good-quality and evenly spread public services are provided. If we do not, we could find ourselves with more such cases, not fewer. As Mary Scanlon said, we will therefore support the SNP Government’s amendment, and we hope that by going down that route we get value for money and good-quality public services and do not end up with more horrifying individual cases.
Let me move on to a couple of specific issues. One area that has given me some concern is the reducing budget for wardens in sheltered housing—in Aberdeenshire at least. I picked up on the issue during the election campaign, when a number of people chose to raise it with me. I am concerned that there appears to be a trend in local authorities to prioritising cutting the cost of the services while not necessarily taking into account how best value can be achieved for the limited expenditure that is possible.
The specific case that I came across is a proposal to share warden services between two areas of sheltered accommodation that are 16 miles apart. The point of any such decision is, of course, to allow the providers to cut the number of staff or hours, but the effect is that transport will have to be provided, sometimes in emergencies or poor weather conditions, between the two sites.
It strikes me that there is an inconsistency in the way that budget cuts are being applied. Is the cabinet secretary in a position to express an opinion on how efficiencies are best achieved in areas such as sheltered housing? It is my intention to discuss the issue in significantly greater detail with council officials and some of the residents who may be affected.
We are in a difficult position. There have been a number of horrifying incidents, not least the case of Mrs V in Dundee. The issue has been put back on our agenda at a time when we must treat budgetary efficiency as a key element of how we ensure that good-quality and evenly spread public services are provided. If we do not, we could find ourselves with more such cases, not fewer. As Mary Scanlon said, we will therefore support the SNP Government’s amendment, and we hope that by going down that route we get value for money and good-quality public services and do not end up with more horrifying individual cases.
In the same item of business
The Presiding Officer (Tricia Marwick)
NPA
Good morning. The first item of business is a debate on motion S4M-00234, in the name of Jackie Baillie, on caring for Scotland’s older people.09:15
Jackie Baillie (Dumbarton) (Lab)
Lab
I welcome the opportunity to open this debate on caring for Scotland’s older people. I can think of nothing more important that deserves the Parliament’s urg...
The Deputy First Minister and Cabinet Secretary for Health, Wellbeing and Cities Strategy (Nicola Sturgeon)
SNP
I begin by doing what I failed to do yesterday when I spoke, which was to welcome Michael Matheson to his new role and to say how much I am looking forward t...
Murdo Fraser (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Con)
Con
I am very grateful to Nicola Sturgeon for giving way. One of the major concerns for residents is the future of the homes. Has the cabinet secretary had any d...
Nicola Sturgeon
SNP
A variety of discussions of that nature are taking place, as the member would expect. I am sure that landlords of the homes will be having discussions with a...
Michael McMahon (Uddingston and Bellshill) (Lab)
Lab
I welcome the fact that the cabinet secretary has spoken directly to COSLA and that discussions are continuing. Have the cabinet secretary’s officials been t...
Nicola Sturgeon
SNP
The Government has a direct interest not only in ensuring that plans are in place overall but in ensuring that arrangements are in place authority by authori...
Neil Findlay (Lothian) (Lab)
Lab
Will the cabinet secretary take an intervention?
Nicola Sturgeon
SNP
I will take one more intervention on Southern Cross, but I have to make progress.
Neil Findlay
Lab
Thank you. West Lothian Council advises me that its contingency plans include seeking placements for residents with other local authorities, suspending respi...
Nicola Sturgeon
SNP
I have already said, in response to an earlier intervention, that the presumption that underpins our contingency arrangements is that older people will not b...
Jackie Baillie
Lab
Will the cabinet secretary take an intervention?
Nicola Sturgeon
SNP
I have a lot of material to get through, but if the Presiding Officer will bear with me, I will take an intervention.
Jackie Baillie
Lab
It is really just to correct what the cabinet secretary said. For the record, I have received no such e-mail.
Nicola Sturgeon
SNP
I have a copy of it here, so I am sure that Jackie Baillie will take it up with the leader of West Lothian Council. I am holding a copy of an e-mail to Ms Ba...
Mary Scanlon (Highlands and Islands) (Con)
Con
I thank the Labour Party for using its time to debate this topic and I commend Jackie Baillie for her well-considered and measured speech.An estimated £4.5 b...
The Presiding Officer
NPA
We move to the open debate. I remind members that they have six minutes in which to speak. We have a wee bit of time in hand, so if you take interventions we...
Claire Baker (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Lab)
Lab
Today’s debate addresses a significant issue that is facing the new Scottish Government. Scotland has an ageing population. People are living longer but not ...
Fiona McLeod (Strathkelvin and Bearsden) (SNP)
SNP
As a returning MSP, I have to say that it is a great privilege to make my first speech in what, to me, is a new Parliament. It is also an honour and a respon...
Neil Findlay
Lab
Perhaps the people in Strathkelvin and Bearsden buy food for their older people in M and S, but where I come from many certainly do not.
Fiona McLeod
SNP
I apologise—I was probably being a bit flippant. All I was trying to say was that older people in such situations tend to eat something in a plastic microwav...
The Deputy Presiding Officer (Elaine Smith)
Lab
I call John Finnie, to be followed by Alex Johnstone. John Finnie is making his first speech in the chamber.10:01
John Finnie (Highlands and Islands) (SNP)
SNP
Care of our older people has always been a priority, and older people were the major beneficiaries of the achievements of the previous Government, which deli...
Alex Johnstone (North East Scotland) (Con)
Con
I congratulate John Finnie on his maiden speech and I welcome the fact that he raised a number of constructive issues that we will need to deal with in the d...
Jackie Baillie
Lab
Does the member acknowledge that the overall spending on social care, particularly for older people, runs to billions of pounds and that free personal care i...
Alex Johnstone
Con
Indeed, but I believe that it is indicative of the problem that our commitment to such things will always be more expensive than we hoped it would be.I want ...
Mark McDonald (North East Scotland) (SNP)
SNP
Does the member accept the point that the private sector is good in some areas but there are other areas in which profit-driven motivation is neither require...
Alex Johnstone
Con
I do not believe that there is any evidence to support the idea that the public sector is somehow intrinsically better than the private sector, and I do not ...
The Deputy Presiding Officer
Lab
I call Bill Walker, who is making his first speech.10:13
Bill Walker (Dunfermline) (SNP)
SNP
Thank you, Presiding Officer. I am proud to be the first Scottish National Party MSP for the Dunfermline constituency, which comprises both the city of Dunfe...