Chamber
Meeting of the Parliament 09 June 2011
09 Jun 2011 · S4 · Meeting of the Parliament
Item of business
Caring for Scotland’s Older People
Indeed, but I believe that it is indicative of the problem that our commitment to such things will always be more expensive than we hoped it would be.
I want to talk about funding and how we deal with the current crisis. Many members will want to blame somebody for the fact that there is less money around than there was before or might otherwise have been had the situation been different. The fact is that we have a large number of people who rely on funding in their later years and who will potentially suffer because there is less money around. That is why anyone who makes a special plea for a particular budget increase in an area must accept that equivalent budget cuts might be necessary to achieve it. I am the first to argue that we need to follow the approach that the Government appears to be taking of finding efficiency in systems to ensure that cuts, where they are made, are small and evenly balanced and do not ultimately target individual groups or, for that matter, individuals, who might suffer as a result.
That is why I will always argue for the idea that we need competition in the provision of care for the elderly and that we need to incorporate the idea as a key element of how we achieve not only good value for money in public expenditure but good-quality care across the board for the maximum number of people who require it.
It worries me to hear so many members’ maiden speeches—I return perhaps to John Finnie—in which they seem to say that they believe fundamentally that the public sector is good and the private sector is bad. They seem to have an aversion to profit, perhaps in this area and perhaps in others, but they do not realise that if we do not have wealth creation in our economy we will have no public expenditure at all.
I want to talk about funding and how we deal with the current crisis. Many members will want to blame somebody for the fact that there is less money around than there was before or might otherwise have been had the situation been different. The fact is that we have a large number of people who rely on funding in their later years and who will potentially suffer because there is less money around. That is why anyone who makes a special plea for a particular budget increase in an area must accept that equivalent budget cuts might be necessary to achieve it. I am the first to argue that we need to follow the approach that the Government appears to be taking of finding efficiency in systems to ensure that cuts, where they are made, are small and evenly balanced and do not ultimately target individual groups or, for that matter, individuals, who might suffer as a result.
That is why I will always argue for the idea that we need competition in the provision of care for the elderly and that we need to incorporate the idea as a key element of how we achieve not only good value for money in public expenditure but good-quality care across the board for the maximum number of people who require it.
It worries me to hear so many members’ maiden speeches—I return perhaps to John Finnie—in which they seem to say that they believe fundamentally that the public sector is good and the private sector is bad. They seem to have an aversion to profit, perhaps in this area and perhaps in others, but they do not realise that if we do not have wealth creation in our economy we will have no public expenditure at all.
In the same item of business
The Presiding Officer (Tricia Marwick)
NPA
Good morning. The first item of business is a debate on motion S4M-00234, in the name of Jackie Baillie, on caring for Scotland’s older people.09:15
Jackie Baillie (Dumbarton) (Lab)
Lab
I welcome the opportunity to open this debate on caring for Scotland’s older people. I can think of nothing more important that deserves the Parliament’s urg...
The Deputy First Minister and Cabinet Secretary for Health, Wellbeing and Cities Strategy (Nicola Sturgeon)
SNP
I begin by doing what I failed to do yesterday when I spoke, which was to welcome Michael Matheson to his new role and to say how much I am looking forward t...
Murdo Fraser (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Con)
Con
I am very grateful to Nicola Sturgeon for giving way. One of the major concerns for residents is the future of the homes. Has the cabinet secretary had any d...
Nicola Sturgeon
SNP
A variety of discussions of that nature are taking place, as the member would expect. I am sure that landlords of the homes will be having discussions with a...
Michael McMahon (Uddingston and Bellshill) (Lab)
Lab
I welcome the fact that the cabinet secretary has spoken directly to COSLA and that discussions are continuing. Have the cabinet secretary’s officials been t...
Nicola Sturgeon
SNP
The Government has a direct interest not only in ensuring that plans are in place overall but in ensuring that arrangements are in place authority by authori...
Neil Findlay (Lothian) (Lab)
Lab
Will the cabinet secretary take an intervention?
Nicola Sturgeon
SNP
I will take one more intervention on Southern Cross, but I have to make progress.
Neil Findlay
Lab
Thank you. West Lothian Council advises me that its contingency plans include seeking placements for residents with other local authorities, suspending respi...
Nicola Sturgeon
SNP
I have already said, in response to an earlier intervention, that the presumption that underpins our contingency arrangements is that older people will not b...
Jackie Baillie
Lab
Will the cabinet secretary take an intervention?
Nicola Sturgeon
SNP
I have a lot of material to get through, but if the Presiding Officer will bear with me, I will take an intervention.
Jackie Baillie
Lab
It is really just to correct what the cabinet secretary said. For the record, I have received no such e-mail.
Nicola Sturgeon
SNP
I have a copy of it here, so I am sure that Jackie Baillie will take it up with the leader of West Lothian Council. I am holding a copy of an e-mail to Ms Ba...
Mary Scanlon (Highlands and Islands) (Con)
Con
I thank the Labour Party for using its time to debate this topic and I commend Jackie Baillie for her well-considered and measured speech.An estimated £4.5 b...
The Presiding Officer
NPA
We move to the open debate. I remind members that they have six minutes in which to speak. We have a wee bit of time in hand, so if you take interventions we...
Claire Baker (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Lab)
Lab
Today’s debate addresses a significant issue that is facing the new Scottish Government. Scotland has an ageing population. People are living longer but not ...
Fiona McLeod (Strathkelvin and Bearsden) (SNP)
SNP
As a returning MSP, I have to say that it is a great privilege to make my first speech in what, to me, is a new Parliament. It is also an honour and a respon...
Neil Findlay
Lab
Perhaps the people in Strathkelvin and Bearsden buy food for their older people in M and S, but where I come from many certainly do not.
Fiona McLeod
SNP
I apologise—I was probably being a bit flippant. All I was trying to say was that older people in such situations tend to eat something in a plastic microwav...
The Deputy Presiding Officer (Elaine Smith)
Lab
I call John Finnie, to be followed by Alex Johnstone. John Finnie is making his first speech in the chamber.10:01
John Finnie (Highlands and Islands) (SNP)
SNP
Care of our older people has always been a priority, and older people were the major beneficiaries of the achievements of the previous Government, which deli...
Alex Johnstone (North East Scotland) (Con)
Con
I congratulate John Finnie on his maiden speech and I welcome the fact that he raised a number of constructive issues that we will need to deal with in the d...
Jackie Baillie
Lab
Does the member acknowledge that the overall spending on social care, particularly for older people, runs to billions of pounds and that free personal care i...
Alex Johnstone
Con
Indeed, but I believe that it is indicative of the problem that our commitment to such things will always be more expensive than we hoped it would be.I want ...
Mark McDonald (North East Scotland) (SNP)
SNP
Does the member accept the point that the private sector is good in some areas but there are other areas in which profit-driven motivation is neither require...
Alex Johnstone
Con
I do not believe that there is any evidence to support the idea that the public sector is somehow intrinsically better than the private sector, and I do not ...
The Deputy Presiding Officer
Lab
I call Bill Walker, who is making his first speech.10:13
Bill Walker (Dunfermline) (SNP)
SNP
Thank you, Presiding Officer. I am proud to be the first Scottish National Party MSP for the Dunfermline constituency, which comprises both the city of Dunfe...