Chamber
Meeting of the Parliament 23 February 2011
23 Feb 2011 · S3 · Meeting of the Parliament
Item of business
Migration and Trafficking
Some weeks ago, I spoke in the debate on the Equal Opportunities Committee’s excellent report on issues relating to the Mental Health (Care and Treatment) (Scotland) Act 2003. Today, we are debating an equally excellent report on migration and trafficking.
Having read through the report’s main conclusions and recommendations, I was tempted to say that a lot of ground had been covered but that, despite the holding of 11 meetings on the subject and the fact that the report runs to 700 paragraphs, it only scratched the surface and raised more questions than answers. I had not intended to say that myself, in case it was perceived as a negative comment, so I was very pleased to read, when I finally got to paragraph 700, that
“the Committee reluctantly recognises that although it has covered a lot of ground in its inquiry, it has only scratched the surface of what are major issues”,
and that the inquiry had raised more questions than answers.
Like others, I thank Margaret Mitchell and her committee for a substantial piece of work, and I trust that their work will be continued beyond May this year. In that context, I question whether 1 hour 20 minutes is sufficient time to debate such a first-class report.
Like Richard Baker, I commend the fresh talent initiative, which the report praises highly. It is always good to know that Scotland can initiate good ideas that can be replicated across the UK. Likewise, I am sure that we can learn from other Governments and devolved Administrations.
I do not think that the UK Border Agency is the only organisation in which there is confusion about devolution issues. There could be much-improved working and communication among the Scottish Parliament, the Scottish Government and Westminster on a host of issues across the board. Although the letter from Damian Green, the UK Minister of State for Immigration, came to us only hours before the debate, I was pleased to read that the memorandum of understanding between the Scottish Government and the Home Office
“is due for review after the Scotland Bill has been concluded.”
We welcome that.
Paragraph 134 of the report mentions that migrants from eastern Europe pay 37 per cent more in taxes than they receive in benefits and are more likely to start their own business. I know from one of Scotland’s biggest shortbread manufacturers, which is based in the area that I represent, that if migrant workers were not available to be involved in its production, it would consider moving some production capacity to Poland or even China.
The committee was right to raise the issue of language classes. Most migrant workers come here to work. They are not available in the daytime when classes are run and they do not mix so much outwith their own community. Investment in English learning for new migrants could save a huge amount of public money in translation fees.
In the past, many professional and highly trained people who have come to the Highlands from Poland and other eastern European countries have had to take jobs that were well below their capability for some considerable time, just to get the opportunity to learn the language. We would all benefit enormously if classes were offered at a time that suited migrants and which did not interfere with daytime work commitments. It is now the case that many eastern European workers use their children to translate. I am sure that members would agree that presenting with symptoms to a general practitioner or to someone else in the national health service can be highly problematic without sufficient language skills.
It is worrying that people do not have sufficient language skills, but it is even more worrying that, as the report says, public service and other service providers that advise and support migrant workers may not be fully aware of migrants’ rights and entitlements.
I was surprised to read the point that the report makes about the Gangmasters Licensing Authority; I am sure that we all thought that the relevant power already existed in Scotland.
Finally, paragraph 664 states that Scotland could be seen as a soft touch for traffickers because of the lack of prosecutions. None of us would want that to be the case.
I highly commend the report.
16:34
Having read through the report’s main conclusions and recommendations, I was tempted to say that a lot of ground had been covered but that, despite the holding of 11 meetings on the subject and the fact that the report runs to 700 paragraphs, it only scratched the surface and raised more questions than answers. I had not intended to say that myself, in case it was perceived as a negative comment, so I was very pleased to read, when I finally got to paragraph 700, that
“the Committee reluctantly recognises that although it has covered a lot of ground in its inquiry, it has only scratched the surface of what are major issues”,
and that the inquiry had raised more questions than answers.
Like others, I thank Margaret Mitchell and her committee for a substantial piece of work, and I trust that their work will be continued beyond May this year. In that context, I question whether 1 hour 20 minutes is sufficient time to debate such a first-class report.
Like Richard Baker, I commend the fresh talent initiative, which the report praises highly. It is always good to know that Scotland can initiate good ideas that can be replicated across the UK. Likewise, I am sure that we can learn from other Governments and devolved Administrations.
I do not think that the UK Border Agency is the only organisation in which there is confusion about devolution issues. There could be much-improved working and communication among the Scottish Parliament, the Scottish Government and Westminster on a host of issues across the board. Although the letter from Damian Green, the UK Minister of State for Immigration, came to us only hours before the debate, I was pleased to read that the memorandum of understanding between the Scottish Government and the Home Office
“is due for review after the Scotland Bill has been concluded.”
We welcome that.
Paragraph 134 of the report mentions that migrants from eastern Europe pay 37 per cent more in taxes than they receive in benefits and are more likely to start their own business. I know from one of Scotland’s biggest shortbread manufacturers, which is based in the area that I represent, that if migrant workers were not available to be involved in its production, it would consider moving some production capacity to Poland or even China.
The committee was right to raise the issue of language classes. Most migrant workers come here to work. They are not available in the daytime when classes are run and they do not mix so much outwith their own community. Investment in English learning for new migrants could save a huge amount of public money in translation fees.
In the past, many professional and highly trained people who have come to the Highlands from Poland and other eastern European countries have had to take jobs that were well below their capability for some considerable time, just to get the opportunity to learn the language. We would all benefit enormously if classes were offered at a time that suited migrants and which did not interfere with daytime work commitments. It is now the case that many eastern European workers use their children to translate. I am sure that members would agree that presenting with symptoms to a general practitioner or to someone else in the national health service can be highly problematic without sufficient language skills.
It is worrying that people do not have sufficient language skills, but it is even more worrying that, as the report says, public service and other service providers that advise and support migrant workers may not be fully aware of migrants’ rights and entitlements.
I was surprised to read the point that the report makes about the Gangmasters Licensing Authority; I am sure that we all thought that the relevant power already existed in Scotland.
Finally, paragraph 664 states that Scotland could be seen as a soft touch for traffickers because of the lack of prosecutions. None of us would want that to be the case.
I highly commend the report.
16:34
In the same item of business
The Deputy Presiding Officer (Alasdair Morgan)
SNP
The next item of business is a debate on motion S3M-7950, in the name of Margaret Mitchell, on the Equal Opportunities Committee’s report into migration and ...
Margaret Mitchell (Central Scotland) (Con)
Con
I welcome today’s debate on the Equal Opportunities Committee’s migration and trafficking report. Our wide-ranging inquiry covered issues of both reserved an...
The Cabinet Secretary for Justice (Kenny MacAskill)
SNP
I congratulate Margaret Mitchell and the Equal Opportunities Committee on securing the debate, which provides an opportunity to tackle important issues. I re...
Jim Hume (South of Scotland) (LD)
LD
In the ports of Cairnryan and Stranraer, the authorities have detected human trafficking for inhuman purposes, such as the sex trade. Why, therefore, were th...
Kenny MacAskill
SNP
The Crown and the police take those matters very seriously. As Jim Hume will be aware, the UKBA’s withdrawal has affected the situation. Dumfries and Gallowa...
Mary Scanlon (Highlands and Islands) (Con)
Con
Is the Cabinet Secretary for Justice satisfied with the response from Damian Green, the Minister of State for Immigration? In particular, is he not satisfied...
Kenny MacAskill
SNP
The arrangements are a matter of continuing concern. I appreciate that they are being reviewed south of the border, but we believe that they are prejudicial....
Richard Baker (North East Scotland) (Lab)
Lab
I welcome the Equal Opportunities Committee’s inquiry into migration and trafficking, and the opportunity to debate the committee’s report.Issues that relate...
Mary Scanlon (Highlands and Islands) (Con)
Con
Some weeks ago, I spoke in the debate on the Equal Opportunities Committee’s excellent report on issues relating to the Mental Health (Care and Treatment) (S...
Hugh O’Donnell (Central Scotland) (LD)
LD
I associate myself with Mary Scanlon’s remarks about the length of the debate. Given that the report is one of the most substantial reports that the Equal Op...
Christina McKelvie (Central Scotland) (SNP)
SNP
I know that the Scottish Refugee Council is an organisation that is close to both our hearts. Does the member share my concern that the SRC’s information and...
Hugh O’Donnell
LD
That point is well made and I share the member’s concern. In due course, individual members might consider communicating with George Osborne about that and a...
Christina McKelvie (Central Scotland) (SNP)
SNP
The inquiry by the Equal Opportunities Committee was very important and it will make an important contribution to public discourse about migration in Scotlan...
Malcolm Chisholm (Edinburgh North and Leith) (Lab)
Lab
Given the short time that we have for speeches, I will limit my remarks to the scourge of human trafficking, which is, according the UN Office on Drugs and C...
Stuart McMillan (West of Scotland) (SNP)
SNP
I, too, express my thanks to the clerking team for their hard work and dedication throughout the inquiry. The committee ensured that a wide range of voices a...
Elaine Smith (Coatbridge and Chryston) (Lab)
Lab
Early in 1948, a plane deporting migrant workers from the United States to Mexico crashed. In his song “Plane Wreck at Los Gatos”, Woody Guthrie displayed hi...
Christopher Harvie (Mid Scotland and Fife) (SNP)
SNP
I, too, thank the Equal Opportunities Committee for its report and Margaret Mitchell for her lucid and liberal introduction.Having lived and worked as an eco...
Bill Kidd (Glasgow) (SNP)
SNP
I am pleased to take part in this debate on the Equal Opportunities Committee’s report on migration and trafficking because I was a member of the committee w...
Robert Brown (Glasgow) (LD)
LD
I join others in thanking the Equal Opportunities Committee for its work on this matter. The report is substantial, has on-going aspirations and will be supp...
Jamie McGrigor (Highlands and Islands) (Con)
Con
I am pleased to close this important debate for the Scottish Conservatives. Like other members, I pay tribute to the excellent work of my friend Margaret Mit...
James Kelly (Glasgow Rutherglen) (Lab)
Lab
Like other members, I congratulate the Equal Opportunities Committee, under the competent leadership of Margaret Mitchell, on looking into the issue. The rep...
The Minister for Housing and Communities (Alex Neil)
SNP
The debate has been interesting and helpful. The view in the chamber on migration and trafficking has been universal. Like everyone else, I commend the commi...
Marlyn Glen (North East Scotland) (Lab)
Lab
It was over a year ago that the Equal Opportunities Committee decided to hold an inquiry into migration and trafficking. During the inquiry we heard from mor...