Committee
Scotland Bill Committee 08 February 2011
08 Feb 2011 · S3 · Scotland Bill Committee
Item of business
Scotland Bill
Thank you, convener—that is appreciated.I will reiterate two questions that the Government believes are crucial to consideration of the bill. First, do the propositions in the bill offer any meaningful transfer of fiscal and economic levers to Scotland? Secondly, what are the likely impacts and risks of the changes that will arise from the bill for the Scottish budget and—more important—for households and businesses across our country?The Government has consistently outlined its concern that the bill in its current form fails on both those questions. Our evidence has highlighted the potential risks from a deflationary bias; the lack of meaningful economic powers; the inadequate borrowing provisions to manage budgetary volatility; the economic inefficiency of the income tax proposals; the modest capital borrowing powers; the lack of detail on the block grant adjustment, the no-detriment rule and the costs of set-up and continuing administration; and concern about the transparency and long-term sustainability of a system that depends on an on-going series of ad hoc technical fixes and adjustments.Since taking office in 2007, the Government has made delivering increasing and sustainable economic growth our core purpose. The bill is not about improving economic growth or providing an opportunity to make a fundamental difference to the lives of the people of Scotland. Without real access to the levers of growth or to social policy, we will simply be changing the accountability arrangements for Scotland’s budget from Whitehall. Under the bill, Westminster will continue to collect and control 85 per cent of Scottish tax revenue. Scotland will remain a part of one of the most centralised systems in the developed world and will have limited power over taxation. We can contrast that with the spectrum of devolution that is offered in other countries and which others, such as the Steel commission, have recommended as a possible solution for Scotland.As is well known, the Scottish Government believes that Scotland’s future will be best secured by independence. However, we recognise that others in the Scottish Parliament do not share that view. That is why we have also proposed an alternative framework—full financial responsibility—that would provide the maximum policy autonomy in a United Kingdom macroeconomic framework.As the paper that I have shared with the committee outlines, a framework of full financial responsibility would devolve to Scotland all tax revenues except VAT; allow the co-ordination of benefit and employment policy in Scotland; provide control over the levers that are crucial to business; and allow us to control the key policy instruments in Scotland. It would also transfer the levers that are required to manage that fiscal transfer by providing proper saving and borrowing powers.The consensus seems to be that raising more of Scotland’s revenues directly will increase the Scottish Parliament’s financial responsibility. That is a key objective of the bill that the committee is scrutinising. I agree with that objective, but it cannot be achieved by assigning a small proportion of income tax revenues, as the bill proposes.The bill’s proposals will create a significant risk to Scotland’s budget and economy. We have highlighted the prospect of a deflationary bias, the inadequate revenue borrowing powers, the modest capital borrowing powers and the lack of clarity on key issues such as administration costs, the block grant adjustment and the no-detriment rule.I turn to the economic benefits of greater financial responsibility. “The Government Economic Strategy” sets out our view on the drivers of economic growth, population, participation and productivity and the importance of economic levers to improve economic performance. Financial responsibility would increase the economic levers for revenue and expenditure that are available to the Scottish Government and would provide the opportunity to enhance the Scottish economy’s productivity and economic performance. That could be manifested in several ways in relation to tax powers and tax changes.Such performance-enhancing levers are not part of the bill’s proposals, which is why it is straightforward to consider the financial impact of the changes relative to the status quo. The committee has been asked to consider a bill that simply replaces one part of the block with an assigned income tax revenue. That is the key difference between our proposals and the bill. The UK Government proposes a revised funding mechanism, whereas full financial responsibility would provide new opportunities to enhance Scotland’s economic performance and increase the Parliament’s accountability and responsibility.
In the same item of business
The Convener
Lab
The next item is further consideration of the Scotland Bill and relevant legislative consent memoranda. I am delighted to welcome to the committee the Cabine...
Stephen Imrie (Clerk)
I apologise if members have not had the opportunity to look through the material that has just been provided to them. I received it at about 20 past 1 today....
The Convener
Lab
It may be helpful for the minister or the cabinet secretary to comment on the issue. Given that the committee met for a pre-meeting at a quarter to 2, it was...
The Minister for Culture and External Affairs (Fiona Hyslop)
SNP
I am more than happy to comment. When we appeared before the committee in December, I indicated that we had had extensive discussion and dialogue with the Un...
The Convener
Lab
We will try to give the material due scrutiny later.I move to the substance of today’s meeting. There are both financial and non-financial matters to cover. ...
The Cabinet Secretary for Finance and Sustainable Growth (John Swinney)
SNP
I put on record that I will need to be at this afternoon’s meeting of the Cabinet, as it comes at a rather critical point in Parliament’s decision-making pro...
The Convener
Lab
That is understood.
John Swinney
SNP
Thank you, convener—that is appreciated.I will reiterate two questions that the Government believes are crucial to consideration of the bill. First, do the p...
Brian Adam (Aberdeen North) (SNP)
SNP
The committee has heard that Organisation for Economic Co-operation and Development figures show that growth in public spending has been higher than growth i...
John Swinney
SNP
Essentially, my point—and this is the point that we make in the analysis with which we have provided the committee—is that, over the period that the Governme...
Brian Adam
SNP
How long will the period that we are about to enter last? When will we return to the previous position of spending outstripping tax receipts?
John Swinney
SNP
I expect that we will be back into that period before the Scotland Bill is implemented. It is not for me to tell the committee when the bill will be implemen...
Brian Adam
SNP
You are suggesting that income tax will rise more slowly than all taxes in general. What evidence do you have that income tax will rise more slowly in the lo...
John Swinney
SNP
The historical patterns tell us what we need to know in this respect. It is pretty clear that that is the pattern that it would be realistic to expect in the...
Brian Adam
SNP
Can you point us to detailed evidence on that, either now or in writing?
John Swinney
SNP
With the greatest respect, Mr Adam, I can point only to the historical trends. I suspect that, if I were able to point to future trends, the Chancellor of th...
Brian Adam
SNP
From your engagement with the business community, can you tell us anything about its feelings about the devolution of corporation tax?
John Swinney
SNP
To be fair, I think that the business community will have mixed views on the matter. Some members will be very comfortable with and positive about such a mov...
The Convener
Lab
In response to Brian Adam, you appeared to indicate that income tax’s share of the tax take was declining. However, figures from the Scottish Parliament info...
John Swinney
SNP
I do not think that that was my point. I apologise if I did not make it clear enough but what I said was that public spending was rising at a faster rate tha...
David McLetchie (Edinburgh Pentlands) (Con)
Con
I want to follow on from Mr Adam’s questions and nail down some of the numbers. I am looking at the income tax proposals additional information summary, with...
John Swinney
SNP
So that I can follow carefully what Mr McLetchie is saying, could he just—
David McLetchie
Con
I am referring to table 1.
John Swinney
SNP
Is this in “Scotland Bill Income Tax Proposals—Additional Information”?
David McLetchie
Con
Yes. I think that that is what I said at the start.
John Swinney
SNP
Sure.
David McLetchie
Con
If we look at table 1 and at the four years of the spending review period from 2011-12 onwards, I think that, in 2011-12, we see a deficiency between the Sco...
John Swinney
SNP
This really gets to the nub of the issue. It goes back to what I said in answer to Mr Adam’s point about the historical trends. I said that, to me, the forth...
David McLetchie
Con
There is—
John Swinney
SNP
Let me complete this. There is of course a choice to be made here. One can opt for the mechanism set out currently in the Scotland Bill, but we should do it ...