Chamber
Meeting of the Parliament 08 December 2010
08 Dec 2010 · S3 · Meeting of the Parliament
Item of business
Property Factors (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1
Like other members, I congratulate Patricia Ferguson, the bill’s sponsor, on her persistence and dedication in bringing this measure to Parliament and, I might also say, on her determination to make it through from Glasgow for this debate, notwithstanding the disruption to rail services.
The Parliament last debated the subject in March this year. At that time, I said that the Conservatives would give fair consideration to the bill and measure its proposals against the alternative of a voluntary accreditation scheme that the Scottish Government was pursuing with stakeholders in the sector in line with the recommendation made in the report of the Office of Fair Trading, which has been alluded to.
In that context, it is worth noting that the OFT report recommended that such a scheme should be up and running within 18 months and, should it not prove effective within two years, that the Parliament should legislate for a statutory scheme. Those of us who were prepared to give a fair wind to a voluntary accreditation scheme have been badly let down by both the Government and the sector. Despite the urgency of the OFT recommendation, we have seen a leisurely approach, suggesting a casual indifference to the problems that have been highlighted, or an inability in the sector to sort itself out. For example, for a group that was launched in May 2009 to take over a year to launch a public consultation on core standards for an accreditation scheme is clear evidence of procrastination.
Members will recall the minister’s rather defensive performance in our debate last March on the subject of timescales. Now we have learned from the minister, in evidence given to the committee, that the Government will devote no more resources to progressing the accreditation scheme while the bill is being considered by Parliament.
All that suggests that the Government has given up on voluntary accreditation, but we as a Parliament certainly cannot give up on the many people who receive a poor standard of factoring services or who—worse still—are victims of the appalling sharp practices that have been described graphically by Patricia Ferguson today and by other members in other parliamentary debates.
In evidence to the committee, Consumer Focus Scotland said:
“We are still hopeful that a scheme”—
the accreditation scheme—
“will be established soon, but it has been a long process to get here ... there seems to be a reluctance among those in the industry to take ownership of the scheme. So we are now of the mind that the consumer interest in the market would be best served by some form of statutory regulation.”—[Official Report, Local Government and Communities Committee, 15 September 2010; c 3415.]
That sums up my view and that of my Conservative colleagues.
I welcome the bill’s wide scope and its intention to include registered social landlords and land-owning maintenance companies—which have been much discussed—even if drafting amendments might be required to bring them fully within the bill’s scope.
I also welcome the fact that the registration scheme will sit on top of a statutory code of conduct that will set out the service standards that owners and tenants can expect. I have no doubt that that can build on the Herculean labours of those who participated in the voluntary accreditation scheme group, but—I trust—with a good deal more urgency than they have evidenced so far. With a statutory code of conduct, the Scottish Government of whatever complexion will at least have a responsibility as the driver of a code of conduct rather than the facilitator of a voluntary scheme, which I suspect is half the problem.
Of course, what I have said does not mean that the bill in its present form is perfect. Several concerns were expressed in evidence to the committee, are highlighted in its report, have been described today by Patricia Ferguson, Duncan McNeil, the minister and Mary Mulligan and—I have no doubt—will be described by members who follow me. We need to ensure that appropriate transition measures are in place if a property factor is deregistered. A genuine debate must be had about the appropriate dispute resolution mechanism. On balance, I prefer the option of using the home owner housing panel as the appropriate body, rather than the ombudsman scheme, which the Government prefers.
It is to be hoped that a registration scheme will improve standards among service providers, but I believe firmly in the power of the market as a driver of standards. One issue that remains to be addressed properly is the barriers to switching property factors, which exist as a result of entrenched title conditions that favour the status quo and, in many instances, the factor that the developer of an estate or block of flats selected.
The relevant legislation is complex—it involves the Tenements (Scotland) Act 2004 and the Title Conditions (Scotland) Act 2003, which the Parliament has passed. However, an overriding statutory provision is needed to facilitate the ability to switch factors on a majority vote of the property owners who cast their votes. I appreciate that Patricia Ferguson’s bill does not cover that and I suspect that the issue requires a more thorough review of existing law. However, I noted that the minister referred to the 2003 act in the context of land-owning maintenance companies. Perhaps that is an avenue for further examination. Whatever happens, if need be, I hope that an incoming Government will consider the wider competition-driven requirement as a priority for the next parliamentary session.
I support the bill, which enjoys wide public support, if my mailbag is anything to go by. Patricia Ferguson has struck a chord with her bill and I look forward to it proceeding at subsequent stages.
16:14
The Parliament last debated the subject in March this year. At that time, I said that the Conservatives would give fair consideration to the bill and measure its proposals against the alternative of a voluntary accreditation scheme that the Scottish Government was pursuing with stakeholders in the sector in line with the recommendation made in the report of the Office of Fair Trading, which has been alluded to.
In that context, it is worth noting that the OFT report recommended that such a scheme should be up and running within 18 months and, should it not prove effective within two years, that the Parliament should legislate for a statutory scheme. Those of us who were prepared to give a fair wind to a voluntary accreditation scheme have been badly let down by both the Government and the sector. Despite the urgency of the OFT recommendation, we have seen a leisurely approach, suggesting a casual indifference to the problems that have been highlighted, or an inability in the sector to sort itself out. For example, for a group that was launched in May 2009 to take over a year to launch a public consultation on core standards for an accreditation scheme is clear evidence of procrastination.
Members will recall the minister’s rather defensive performance in our debate last March on the subject of timescales. Now we have learned from the minister, in evidence given to the committee, that the Government will devote no more resources to progressing the accreditation scheme while the bill is being considered by Parliament.
All that suggests that the Government has given up on voluntary accreditation, but we as a Parliament certainly cannot give up on the many people who receive a poor standard of factoring services or who—worse still—are victims of the appalling sharp practices that have been described graphically by Patricia Ferguson today and by other members in other parliamentary debates.
In evidence to the committee, Consumer Focus Scotland said:
“We are still hopeful that a scheme”—
the accreditation scheme—
“will be established soon, but it has been a long process to get here ... there seems to be a reluctance among those in the industry to take ownership of the scheme. So we are now of the mind that the consumer interest in the market would be best served by some form of statutory regulation.”—[Official Report, Local Government and Communities Committee, 15 September 2010; c 3415.]
That sums up my view and that of my Conservative colleagues.
I welcome the bill’s wide scope and its intention to include registered social landlords and land-owning maintenance companies—which have been much discussed—even if drafting amendments might be required to bring them fully within the bill’s scope.
I also welcome the fact that the registration scheme will sit on top of a statutory code of conduct that will set out the service standards that owners and tenants can expect. I have no doubt that that can build on the Herculean labours of those who participated in the voluntary accreditation scheme group, but—I trust—with a good deal more urgency than they have evidenced so far. With a statutory code of conduct, the Scottish Government of whatever complexion will at least have a responsibility as the driver of a code of conduct rather than the facilitator of a voluntary scheme, which I suspect is half the problem.
Of course, what I have said does not mean that the bill in its present form is perfect. Several concerns were expressed in evidence to the committee, are highlighted in its report, have been described today by Patricia Ferguson, Duncan McNeil, the minister and Mary Mulligan and—I have no doubt—will be described by members who follow me. We need to ensure that appropriate transition measures are in place if a property factor is deregistered. A genuine debate must be had about the appropriate dispute resolution mechanism. On balance, I prefer the option of using the home owner housing panel as the appropriate body, rather than the ombudsman scheme, which the Government prefers.
It is to be hoped that a registration scheme will improve standards among service providers, but I believe firmly in the power of the market as a driver of standards. One issue that remains to be addressed properly is the barriers to switching property factors, which exist as a result of entrenched title conditions that favour the status quo and, in many instances, the factor that the developer of an estate or block of flats selected.
The relevant legislation is complex—it involves the Tenements (Scotland) Act 2004 and the Title Conditions (Scotland) Act 2003, which the Parliament has passed. However, an overriding statutory provision is needed to facilitate the ability to switch factors on a majority vote of the property owners who cast their votes. I appreciate that Patricia Ferguson’s bill does not cover that and I suspect that the issue requires a more thorough review of existing law. However, I noted that the minister referred to the 2003 act in the context of land-owning maintenance companies. Perhaps that is an avenue for further examination. Whatever happens, if need be, I hope that an incoming Government will consider the wider competition-driven requirement as a priority for the next parliamentary session.
I support the bill, which enjoys wide public support, if my mailbag is anything to go by. Patricia Ferguson has struck a chord with her bill and I look forward to it proceeding at subsequent stages.
16:14
In the same item of business
The Deputy Presiding Officer (Alasdair Morgan)
SNP
The next item of business is a debate on motion S3M-7531, in the name of Patricia Ferguson, on the Property Factors (Scotland) Bill. Time is fairly tight for...
Patricia Ferguson (Glasgow Maryhill) (Lab)
Lab
I am pleased that we are debating the Local Government and Communities Committee’s stage 1 report on the Property Factors (Scotland) Bill, and I would like t...
Duncan McNeil (Greenock and Inverclyde) (Lab)
Lab
I am pleased to be taking part in the debate as convener of the Local Government and Communities Committee. We were the lead committee that looked at Patrici...
The Minister for Housing and Communities (Alex Neil)
SNP
I welcome the opportunity to debate the Property Factors (Scotland) Bill, which was introduced to the Parliament by Patricia Ferguson. The Government recogni...
Mary Mulligan (Linlithgow) (Lab)
Lab
I, too, am pleased to take part in the stage 1 debate on the Property Factors (Scotland) Bill. I congratulate Patricia Ferguson on getting the bill to this s...
David McLetchie (Edinburgh Pentlands) (Con)
Con
Like other members, I congratulate Patricia Ferguson, the bill’s sponsor, on her persistence and dedication in bringing this measure to Parliament and, I mig...
Jim Tolson (Dunfermline West) (LD)
LD
The Liberal Democrats welcome the member’s bill that Patricia Ferguson has introduced and offer our congratulations to her. I also congratulate the clerks, w...
Sandra White (Glasgow) (SNP)
SNP
I, too, congratulate Patricia Ferguson and thank her for introducing the bill. As one of the original signatories to the bill proposal, I am pleased to speak...
Paul Martin (Glasgow Springburn) (Lab)
Lab
Like other members, I congratulate Patricia Ferguson on introducing her bill and getting it to stage 1. She should be commended for her hard work and diligen...
Elizabeth Smith (Mid Scotland and Fife) (Con)
Con
Stage 1 is an important staging post in assessing the many issues that are the origin of the bill. I pay tribute to Patricia Ferguson for the methodical mann...
Robert Brown (Glasgow) (LD)
LD
Does Elizabeth Smith accept that clarity on the point that she has just raised might make it easier for some people to accept liability for payments, and not...
Elizabeth Smith
Con
Mr Brown makes a valid point, and I and the Conservative party in general accept it. It is a strong message in the bill.The relationship between the property...
Bob Doris (Glasgow) (SNP)
SNP
I welcome the opportunity to speak on the Property Factors (Scotland) Bill at stage 1. I thank Patricia Ferguson for introducing the bill, and I thank my fel...
Malcolm Chisholm (Edinburgh North and Leith) (Lab)
Lab
Factoring is an enormous issue in the new-build flats in my constituency, albeit not in the traditional tenements, which in Edinburgh have never had factors....
Joe FitzPatrick (Dundee West) (SNP)
SNP
I echo others in the chamber in congratulating Patricia Ferguson on the bill, which touches on a subject that is of great concern to many of our constituents...
Robert Brown (Glasgow) (LD)
LD
On behalf of the Liberal Democrats, I praise Patricia Ferguson for introducing the bill and for the manner in which she has done so. Although this debate wil...
Alex Johnstone (North East Scotland) (Con)
Con
The debate that we have had today and the process that led us to it form a good example of the Parliament at its best. I only wonder why it has taken us so l...
Mary Mulligan
Lab
This has been an excellent debate in which all members have made quite heartfelt pleas for legislation. That is not always the case in this chamber.As Jim To...
Alex Neil
SNP
This debate on the principles of the bill and the issues that are to be addressed at stage 2 has been good and consensual. I congratulate Patricia Ferguson a...
David McLetchie
Con
In relation to those figures—£2,000 a case and 220 cases a year for the private rented housing panel—is the minister convinced that the panel provides value ...
Alex Neil
SNP
The reality is that it is quasi-judicial. As Mr McLetchie will know, anything that is judicial, and particularly anything that involves lawyers, can be extre...
Robert Brown
LD
Will the minister take a further brief intervention on that?
Alex Neil
SNP
Of course, from another lawyer. Are they going to declare an interest, Presiding Officer?
Robert Brown
LD
The issue is about the need to have at the end of the process an enforceable order so that everybody knows where they stand. It is a judicial process and it ...
Alex Neil
SNP
The enforceable order would be the responsibility of other authorities and not necessarily the panel or ombudsman. My point is that there are a great deal of...
Patricia Ferguson
Lab
I very much welcome the content and tone of the debate. I will try to respond as best I can to the issues that members have raised. The debate has demonstrat...
Malcolm Chisholm
Lab
At the recent meeting that I referred to, it seemed that a large number of people were paying 35 per cent commission to factors for their insurance.
Patricia Ferguson
Lab
I would not dispute that. I have heard a variety of figures mentioned. I have also heard about what, in the trade, are loosely called gentlemen’s agreements,...